What tone?

And there is a huge difference in your example and my example. You only see birth place as what make you what you are, I see origin also a reason for that. Your example got none of it. Irrelevant to my point.

What tone? "who are you to say how people feel?". I would much appreciate a quote to backup this statement. I have stated my opinions, but I have not once mentioned that some should feel a certain way, they can feel what they want.

I don't buy the origin argument at all, sorry. As I've said countless times, you're basically saying there is reall no such thing as an American or similar.

That was a serious question. I could have used other words, but other words didn't pop in me up. English is not my first language, I'm unaware of the fact that this sentence got a tone to you (that word you put in front of tone, never heard of it).

I did backup my statement. I said in other words that there are two ways you can be linked to a country. Either by being born and raised in it, or by your origin. I would say let each individual choose what is worth the most to him or her. Okay, you will choose for birth of place. But others will choose the other.

I never said there are no Americans. (Why do we care anyway so much from what country you are or should belong? We are people, not countries.)

We are people, yes. But it seems national pride is a thing of the past. Oh well.

Posts of the week.

Ballack.

Lippi is set to announce the first cut (3 players from the 30 already announced) later today. According to Sky Sport 24, the cuts are supposedly Candreva, Grosso, and one of Rossi and Quagliarella. It would seem that Lippi might not have appreciated that lovely assist Grosso gave us on Saturday.

And now it's official.

Lippi has cut Grosso and Candreva. The following group of 28 will take part in the pre-world cup training camp:



http://www.figc.it/it/204/24607/2010/05/News.shtml

Out of those 28, the 5 players I'd leave out are De Sanctis, Camoranesi, Cossu, Pepe and Quagliarella.

Gattuso has had a manky season for Milan, yet he's going to the world cup?

I think Lippi called Gattuso more for his character and importance inside the locker room than for his skills.

Gattuso before Ambrosini ?
Is it just me or you too find this very wrong ?!

No, it is wrong. But that's Lippi for you.

Italians that aren't called up (for different reasons - Nesta being his own choice):

Balotelli, Totti
Cassano
Ambrosini, Perrotta, Aquilani
Antonini, Nesta, Bonera, Cassetti/Santon
Storari

At least some of these should have been called up.

Lol, that's almost better then the first 11 Italy will put out come the WC

I'm still bitter about guys like Pepe going while Cassano and Balotelli are left behind

Or look at the fullbacks that are chosen and those who are not (Antonini)... and no Ambrosini

Strikers and Wingbacks are better then first XI Italy squad.
In midfield the only player (that is left out) who deserves to play for Italy is Ambrosini.
And Storari or Abbiati in my opinion are better than De Santic.

Balotelli and Cassano can be stars but they have no experience and are not very " good boys". Lippi is afraid

I don't think Antonini is better than Grosso.

Edit: I forgot Grosso had been cut. Does any coach actually want to win the thing? Worst squads from the big names ever.

Because Grosso was cut later, and I could have a non-Juve team (anti-Lippi team) I decided not to mention Grosso.
Grosso left, Antonini right would have been better in my made team.

Yeah, lol, Maradona, Domenech, and Lippi are really ruining 3 huge countries/contenders. I don't see any of them win.

Grosso doesn't deserve to play in any squad. He's just that bad.

I dunno about that, X-Off. Grosso provided a lovely assist to Seedorf last Saturday....

Haha I agree that Grosso doesn't deserve to be there. just because he was awesome 4 years ago doesn't mean a guaranteed spot 4 years later!

IMO he should have dropped Zambro as well. Maggio and Cassani are good enough to cover the right side.

Zambrotta is still good enough, plus he has the experiance and is a good defender, attacking wise he's gone downhill these last few years but overall he's still got more to offer.

Il_diavolo_mtl's Italy lineup (23) considered form/skill/pace over experience

Goalkeepers (2): Buffon (Juventus), De Sanctis (Napoli), Marchetti (Cagliari), Sirigu (Palermo)

Defenders(7): Bocchetti (Genoa), Bonucci (Bari), Cannavaro (Juventus), Cassani (Palermo), Chiellini (Juventus), Criscito (Genoa), Maggio (Napoli), Zambrotta (Milan) Luca antonini (Milan) M.Motta (roma)

Midfielders(8): Camoranesi (Juventus), Cossu (Cagliari), De Rossi (Roma), Gattuso (Milan), Marchisio (Juventus), Montolivo (Fiorentina), Palombo (Sampdoria), Pepe (Udinese), Pirlo (Milan) Mesto (genoa) Cassano (Sampdoria) [u/]

Strikers(6): [b]Borriello (Milan), Di Natale (Udinese), Gilardino (Fiorentina), Iaquinta (Juventus), Pazzini (Sampdoria), Quagliarella (Napoli), Giuseppe Rossi (Villarreal) Balotelli (inter)

Really wish i had room for : Lazzari,Cossu, Quagliarella, Maccarone, santacrocce (had a great season that no one os talking about) Pirlo, Mascara...

This list was made of Lippi's 28-man roster so the italic & underlined and my additions

Il_diavolo_mtl, are you serious? Pirlo is vital to Azzurri every game they play. Without Pirlo Italy plays awful bad. How can you left him out is beyond me.

Agreed.



No Pirlo? Italy would go downhill.

Why can Camoranesi have a place and Pirlo and Ambrosini no ?
Weird.

Mediaset's speculating that Camoranesi is next to be cut, btw.

mtl, this fish likes you but cutting Pirlo - even one who's been mediocre at best for Milan - would be suicidal to Italy even getting out of the group.

And just fyi, you can't add people to the list of 30 already named. (now 28 after grosso and candreva were cut). The 28 is what you've got to work with.


EDIT:
Maradona's made his cuts.

Here's the Argentina list of 23:



link

Datolo and Lavezzi both out. The neapolitans are displeased.

Gutierrez!

Forwards and Samuel are good, the rest are very average.

Is Maradona going to play 4-2-4 ?
Di Maria and Pastore (even he plays in the attack) are the only who deserve to play.
Mascherano was underaverage this season. And the rest of midfield are just to young and with no ex.

Why Camo from the Juve group? Wasn't he one of the few who actually did something this season at Juve?

I still can't get over the Juve bias from Lippi!! Aside from Marchisio and Chiellini, no Juve player should have any business being on that team!

This is going to be another terrible summer, going to the bar among the English fans and having to hear them harp on and on about how their team will take everything in site out

Btw mtl, no Pirlo or Zambro? Italy would barely get out of their own half in all the games, Rino I agree he was terrible this season but the other 2 will be vital for Italy.

Camo did stuff this year! Stuff Camo did: be injured, do rehab, get injured again, play 35 minutes, be worse than...a drunk fish who's blindfolded, lather rinse repeat.

Nah, han, from what I saw (and based on discussions with Juve season ticket holders - not in the curva - when I was in Italy earlier this month) the only gobbi to have performed at an overall rating of 6 or higher are Buffon, Chiellini, Marchisio, and Del Piero.

I can't believe Maradona left Lavezzi out. To me the guy should be a starter. Oh how I wish for Argentina to get their asses kicked in the World Cup.

My person is taking part in a fantasy pool on the WC at work. She's got the Argies going out in the group stage.

(And Italy getting slaughtered again by Spain, who she thinks will win).

Your person thinks rationally.

First of all to field the criticism i will discuss my moves

Keeping Camo : What other italian Mid outside of cassano and cossu (neither will make it) gives us 1v1 Creativity, a attribute sorely lacking from the italian midfield.

Dropping Zambro : in 2006, he was my favorite player (i was a RB at the time ) and is performances were masterful, even scoring 2 vital goals!! That being said over the past 4 years he has lost the speed and willingness to push forward as he always gets caught running back after much faster players in Serie A, which, while remains my favorite league, isn't known for it's speed. The fact that he has great defensive awareness is very important, don't get me wrong but unless Lippi want's to keep his fullbacks all the way back, i think italy can do better with more 2-dimensional players. Class player but i think it's time for him to hand over the baton to cassani/motta/antonini/criscito. When it comes to the world cup, we need hungry players who who give it their ALL!!!! to place italy on the map again, and not players who because of age, sense of accomplishment, boat loads of money and having already won it, will go about their work somewhat less-inspired (not saying Zambro specifically but this is a big problem with our azzuri.

Dropping pirlo : From what i saw in 2006, he was the man with no other player in italy able to pull the strings he did in midfield. While cutting him outright may seam to be very harsh (even stupid) i feel that the young talent has caught up to the latter generation when it comes to the distributing midfielder. I feel that despite having a torrid year, Montolivo has been fantastic for his team in both aspects of the game, a feat that i hope we can all agree pirlo's not matched over the past 4 years. Also palombo has made HUGE strides to be a star for italy in a similar position. similar HUNGER vs experience argument.

Maybe it's because i'm young and have been cast aside for pretentious, prima donna 30+year olds that didn't give a **** and i don't feel the same attachment to some of these names as you guys but i feel that hunger+talent+discipline=success .this is my equation as i'm sure you all have yours but i feel Serie A, the league we all love will suffer if we keep calling up players 1-2 years from retiring for international duty.

That being said i very much would love to hear how pirlo was great 4 years ago warrants him a spot over players that have played their hearts out for a chance they never had because of
-player X was here in 2006 and that's all that matters
or
-player X played for juve at one point in his life

You really see Montolivo as reason to leave out Pirlo in Azzurri team ánd squad? Pirlo literally keeps Italy's team together in all matches, he makes it work.

at the risk of losing all credibility, yes i do montolivo was fantastic this year, he maybe didn't get the stats he deserved but his passing/defending would have made him midfielder of the season had fiorentina finished top 4

First off, mtl, I have to say that I think Cossu will make the cut. Cassano wasn't called up at all so he's a non-issue. And I wouldn't have major complaints if Zambrotta were cut.

As regards Palombo, he's been immense this year and is one of the reasons I like Samp and not that other club that plays at the Marassi. But he's more of an interdictor, not a playmaker. And the fact o fthe matter is that neither he nor anyone else on Lippi's list (or that should've been on Lippi's list) can do what Pirlo can. Montolivo has shown glimpses for the last few years but he regularly crumbles in pressure situations (one of which I saw up close not 3 weeks ago when after 15 minutes at the San Siro, he went missing and with him, the rest of the Viola). I wouldn't dare hang my hopes for playmaking and ball distribution on the shoulders of Montolivo if I were Lippi.

The other thing about Pirlo's underperforming for the majority of the season is that this year's Milan was built around Ronaldinho, with distribution going through or around him. It's my opinion (and I may well be the lone fish on this one) that because of this, Pirlo's ability to do Pirlo stuff has been hindered because he's having to do other stuff -- but he's actually turning out to be a respectable traditional defensive mid. When he plays for Italy, Pirlo is further up the pitch and play generally runs through or around him. He's got De Rossi watching his back (and hopefully either Palombo or Marchisio there too, this fish would be happy with either), and it's a different style of play.

For what it may be worth, here's who this fish would start (based on the current list of 28) if he were Italy's coach:

Buffon
Cassani Bonucci Chiellini Criscito
De Rossi Pirlo Palombo/Marchisio
Di Natale Iaquinta Rossi

Also, speaking of Italy's NT, Gazzetta is reporting that in all likelihood, Cesare Prandelli will be the next coach. There've been long talks between him and Abete and apparently agreement has been reached. link

IMO good news for Italy, more bad news for the Viola.

i personally just think montolivo needs a stage to break out of his shell, like he WAS doing in the CL till bayern cheated them out. and i know that pirlo is lippi's first choice Treqqie. i just fear we will have a slow team that passes back and forth with no creativity, end ball pass or anything with lippi's lineup.

I'd love to see Montolivo break out but...I'm just not sure he's ever going to. I do like the kid.

Italy really needs a good young trequartista/regista.

Pretty much everyone is reporting that Laurent Blanc will be the next coach of the French NT.

and Domechech (spl?) will be demote to dishwasher at the local McDonalds

+1

This post made my day.

Here's one of Pepsi's world cup ads: link

Here is Spain's final squad (courtesy of bbc):



Marcos Senna, Dani Guiza, and Santi Cazorla all cut.

I'm so damn corious to see how is their midfield going to work. Techincaly they have 4 playmakers, 2 center midfielders and 1 offensive midfielder.
If Vicente del Bosque does the right moves in midfield, Spain will have a lot of chances.
IMO they have the strongest individuals in this WC, but they just dont have spirit.
Italy > Spain.

I can't help but think I'm looking at the squad of soon to be world cup winners when I see Spain's call-ups. they're stupidly good (© Danny).

world class goalkeeper
world class defense
world class midfield
world class attack

If they don't win it, they will be the biggest underachievers EVER.

That argument would have made sense had they not played like THAT in the Euros, making teams as great as Germany look helpless and ordinary. I think they've found unity/enthusiasm/spirit/whateveryoucallit.

EDIT: I hope by the Italy>Spain thing you mean your favorite is still Italy, cause you can't even compare these two teams at the moment. Spain are FAR better.