i so agree, but carlo and milan see him as a player/person they like to have around..and he prlly is very useful to have around in training...we may just have to live with this guy. i cringe whenever i see him subbed on tho

What are you talking about ?

Didn't Carlo bring Kaka' into a team with the likes of Rivaldo, Shevchenko, Pirlo, Seedorf and Rui ? .. And within a couple of months, Kaka' showed the San Siro what he can do.

Gourcuff came aboard a team with lesser midfield options of that Kaka' was brought into. He had several chances, but if Carlo Ancelotti, the man behind Kaka's rise to being the recipient of both the Ballon d'Or and FIFA World Player of the Year awards .. I think he didn't meet Carlo's standards to get a starting spot in this team. Just like Gilardino, who has potential but can't complement a team like Milan.

As for Broochi, he can go f2ck himself ! I would like to see more of Flamini and a fit Emerson this time around

If Yoann doesn't meet Carlo's standards I somehow find it hard to see how Brocchi does

personally I was one who always defended Gila, you know this first hand R7 but still even after a bad season in 06/07 he still managed to get a lot of playing time, it was at the end of last season when Carlo finally gave up on him.

Personally I find it hard to believe that Yoann didn't get the playing time he deserved just because he wasn't 'good' enough, especially when I see a player like Brocchi get the nod ehead of him, even when we're behind and need a goal and instead of the creative Yoann Brocchi still gets picked over him. I just think that Carlo never really liked him. And if there is one thing that I don't like about Carlo it's the fact that he has favourites.

As for Kaka, you can't really compare, for one thing he was older and had a great reputation coming into the team, and secondly he is Kaka, there was always that something special that you could see, Yoann might not be the next superstar like Kaka, Ronaldo or Messi but he is a really good player who I think could have really come into the team and made a difference if he was given half the chance, look at what he is doing now with Bordeux that he is playing consistantly

The fish doll senses some repressed anger here, Habitant. Go on, tell us how you REALLY feel.

^^^^


substitute Romeo with Brocchi

^^

corrie dello sports saying milan to again attempt for ivanavic

Ohh,...Gourcuff and Brocchi...

This is no Championship Manager.
And now I honestly have to say it... reading this board's posts it looks like Brocchi is the worst player in Serie A!

Even though it's Corriere reporting it, I wonder if there might be a grain of truth in the story. I wouldn't be surprised if Milan reopened negotiations.

maybe this time with straight money no loan thing

Unfortunately, I think it'll cost more than Milan would be willing to pay for him. The only way he'll be a Milan player, in my opinion, is on a year long loan, with no option for a permanent deal.

in that case i dont think milan will go for him they will look elseware

Gourcuff is a very talented player. I have never said otherwise, I have always stated that I see Zidane in him, the way he controls the ball and moves with it ...

But all things aside, Carlo is not to blame, it is Gourcuff who didn't integrate into the team ... For Bordeux he might be super, but at Milan he never showed consistency. After Gourcuff scored the goal with Bordeux, Carlo said that he wasn't surprised and that he knows what potential Gourcuff has .. It is just in his consistency .. He also said that Milan will keep a close eye on him while in France .. So basically, if they see some improvements from him, he comes back if not then thats that.

Gilardino couldn't handle the pressure of playing for Milan. At Parma he was king, at Milan he was cr@p, but at Fiorentina .. it is not as big a club as Milan, and it doesn't have Stars like Kaka', Seedorf, Pirlo, Maldini that overshadow him without exerting much effort .. hence he will be at ease there and probably get his place back with the nationale.

bottom line is, Carlo saw something in Kaka' and played him ahead of Rivaldo, then ahead of Rui ... Rivaldo and Rui Costa, back then in 2003 those were Super Stars of the game. While Gourcuff came into a deflated team, a team that didn't have much depth, yet struggled to find consistency in his game, now you can blame Carlo all you want, but the same can't be said about Pato ? Can it ... And we will see this season, what he will do with the two Uruguayans.

Like I said, how can he integrate into the team with only ten minutes every 4 games or so? It's not fair to a player that is still developing and trying to integrate into the team. And what I find irritating about this is the fact that Carlo would deliberately play a player like Brocchi ahead of him. I don't know how you can keep coming with ways to defend Carlo regarding this issue.

I'm not talking about Gila and how he played, I think we've been over this issue countless times. I'm talking about how Carlo treated him, and until the final part of last season Gila always got chances, it's only after last seasons christmas break that Carlo finally gave up. Which is far more different treatment to the one Yoann got. I just don't think he was treated fairly by Carlo.

Like I said, Kaka is just one of those players, and Rivaldo had been at Milan for an entire season before Kaka came in and never really did anything, anyone could have come in and did better then him. Kaka is one of those players that you can see superstar written all over them, he's special. It's not fair to compare him to Yoann, even if Yoann is a very good player in his own right, I don't think he can be compared to players like Kaka.

Btw, you talk about how Yoann was never consistant, and I already said why I think he never found his feet at Milan because he was never given a decent chance, but you see a player like Seedorf who we all know could be amazing on his day, walking around week in week out in the league and still Yoann doesn't get the chnce to replace him. Personally I just think that Carlo never really liked him

OK, this Gouruff-Gila stuff is becoming BORRRIIING now... it'd not be a bad idea if we talk about our new players (Flamini, Cardacio, Viudez, etc) a little...

Well we know nothing about the Uru boys so what can we talk about other then hoping they get the chances to play?

Cardacio's kinda cute.

Broochi, regardless of what the majorities opinion is on here of him (and I am one of those who don't consider him 'Milan quality'), still he is a utility player and he was the only stand in for either Gattuso or Ambrosini.

Gourcuff on the other hand trained for 2 seasons under Carlo. Carlo knows better than any of us about his ability. I don't keep defending Carlo, I have great respect for the man, regardless of what options he had at the bench, he defied the odds on many counts.




Rivaldo was never in good terms with Ancelotti too, but what I am saying is he is a super star during that time.

But for Kaka' to take the place of the experience and intelligence of Rivaldo, as you said, he is special !

But I am not comparing Gourcuff to Kaka' han, what I am saying is, Gourcuff had a better chance at getting a starting place in the team. And in his first season, Carlo played him on several accounts he did play over 30 games in his first season at Milan han (even if most were for 20 mins). You remember when carlo brought him on against Bayern ? And they eat him up ?

Maybe .... WOW What a goal by Deco !!!!

I don't care who, just stop debating over Gila and Gourcuff honestly you and R7 have been repeating the same words for months now and I doubt you will ever agree about this issue. stop tiring yourselves! especially it's not worth it to debate over Gila as he's completely a Viola player. he's a closed book as far as Milan is concerned.

When we were down last season and needed a goal, and Carlo would sub in Brocchi for one of the defensive mids instead of putting in Yoann or another striker... It would be fine if he was used as just a replacement for Rino or Ambro but not the way Carlo uses him. And Brocchi should not be part of the team, he's not even good as a utility player, he's just bad and should have never been brought back in by the management. And for Carlo to continue using him is just irritating to no end especially when there are better players on the bench, now let's see what will happen to Cardacio and Viudez, if they suffer the same fate Gourcuff did.

Ads for Carlo seeing him in training, that's not enough, training is training, actually going out there on the pitch in a competitive match and giving him the time he needs is a totally different thing. He only defied the odds in 06/07 in the CL and that was mostly Kaka truning on some super human form for the CL. The other times he's won important titles for Milan he had probably the best squad in Europe at the time. Great defence, great midfield and great attack, and still having guys like Rui on the bench, I could have won the CL and the league with that squad.


Rivaldo was never good in Milan regardless of how Carlo felt about him. Like I said, it would have been easy for anyone to take his place, he just was never good enough for Milan

You are comparing their situations though, as in, if Kaka was able to do it then Yoann should be able to do it too. And despite us not having a team like we had when Kaka came in, the midfield was still practically the same as it was back then and anyone would find it hard to break into a midfield that had been playing together for years. It's just not the same situations and they can't be compared imo. I don't think he had that much minutes under his belt in his first season, I only remember a handful of games that he started in, other then that it was always 10 - 15 minutes here and there.

And against Bayern I agree he shouldn't have been brought in. Carlo put him in in important CL matches for some reason as if he wanted to see him fail. He's just a kid, Carlo should be giving him the chances in the league against small teams not against Bayern in the quarters of the CL!!!! And it's not like Brocchi did so well when he was put in CL games to replace Rino, remember Man U in Old Trafford after he replaced Rino? It was like playing a man short.

btw, James should have done better on that Deco goal

actually it was as if we were playing a man short and man u had an extra player, namely brocchi. he made a nice assist for man u for rooney to score the winner.

The fish doll agrees with zd. Can we please stop these epic debates about the relative values of Brocchi and Gourcuff? At least can we move them to the player threads and keep them off of the transfer season thread? Thanks!

EDIT: And...there's actually news, of sorts!

Mediaset is reporting (link) that there'll be a meeting to include Berlusconi after the game tonight to plan the new strategy on buying a defender.

Galliani, Braida and Carletto will meet with Berlusconi. The prime target remains Branislav Ivanovic. The Serbian defender doesn't want to stay at Chelsea, which he's already told Scolari and Kenyon. Milan, according to this article, may offer to buy him outright for 10million, to be paid over two years.

The article also hypothesizes that Berlusconi might get personally involved in this one because he and Abramovich get on well together. Apparently, Abramovich was a dinner guest at Berlusconi's villa on Sardinia over ferragosto (this past Friday).

Milan have become the latest Serie A side linked with a swoop for free agent Freddie Ljungberg.

The Swede terminated his contract with West Ham United by mutual consent and is awaiting an offer for his next step.

Lazio and Roma have both been mentioned as potential employers, but this evening Milan joined the race.

The Rossoneri are desperately seeking reinforcements for their defence and would be able to afford his wages, even if they wouldn’t go so far as to match the £3m per season provided by West Ham.

It is well known that Milan value experience in their squad, so the 31-year-old would be welcome at San Siro.

Over the past few days agent Claes Elefalk has hinted that there were “more than one Italian club interested” in the ex-Arsenal hero

the bold part what does defence needs to do with freddie

I just can't tell what to think of it. He's better than not having someone, but we deserve better. A lot better.

what's he got to do with defence? waste of money and time ...

no i mean th write the C4 writer i think he was drunk or something

Wouldn't surprise me, CMF. He's also recycling very old news. The Ljungberg rumor is from at least a week ago and it turns out that it's Lazio who might be interested, not Milan.

"In caso di emergenza si puo' ricorrere ad Ambrosini in difesa. Stiamo cercando un difensore centrale pero' lo dobbiamo trovare all'altezza dei nostri", dice Galliani prima del Trofeo Berlusconi. L'ad milanista alla domanda 'Ambrosini difensore, non c'è rischio che sia troppo irruento?' spiega "Io non voglio trasformare Massimo in un difensore. Ho semplicemente detto che secondo me in momenti di emergenza si puo' utilizzare in quel ruolo". Galliani chiude parlando di mercato "Se riusciamo a trovare un difensore all'altezza dei nostri altri 5 bene. Noi avevamo in mente Ivanovic ma sembra che l'affare sia tramontato. Lui è uno che ci piace, è difficile trovare difensori centrali. E se dobbiamo prendere giocatori che fanno 10 minuti in un anno è solo uno spreco di soldi".


translation plz

silvio said no defender i think in the post game interview

No defenders coming in?

Freddie Ljungberg and defense in the same sentence.

This is a new low for the media.

Haven't seen Silvio's comments yet but in the one above, Galliani clearly states that Milan are looking for a defender. He says twice that Milan are looking for a defender 'at the same level of ours' (in other words a good one). He says they were looking at Ivanovic but that the deal seems to have fallen through.

http://www.calciomercato.com/index.php?c=24&a=92124

Thanks, CMF.

Here's what Berlusconi says when asked about getting a defender: "Credo che ne abbiamo in casa abbastanza e tutti bravi."

I'd translate it as "I think the ones we have are enough and are all good."

So it would seem that Berlusconi and Galliani aren't on the same page. Hard to say if either one is telling the truth here.

well gallaini comments were pre match during the game he talks to silvio that how we failed in ivanovic saga and then they decide that milan wont get a defender and silvio says that after the game hopefully my suppositions are wrong

gallaini was rite behind silvio when he was giving that interview hopefully he was lying

Or maybe not .. Maybe someone is coming, but no one is making a fuss about it. Who knows, less than two weeks left

Didn't i say it..I knew that after this great performance, Galliani n Silvio would say something like we don't need another defender....I knew it...Instead of Bulersconi to be reasonable to get another defender and just be confident enough ahead of the season...HOw dumb is it to lose two defenders and not get any...WTF is wrong with Silvio...Is he thinking that we'll be alright with our defense..I'm getting angry right now because that's how milan is..After one good performance we'll say we don't need another reinforcement..****..Get Ivanovic once and for all

Naughty word removed.

I think some of you should chill out and stop complaining. This isn't your money.

For one, I'm sure we will get a new defender. I hear even after this game Ancelotti called for another defender... and I think it will be only proper. I'm sure someone in the media is distorting what Berlusconi said.

actully i have seen the video as well it seems quite accurate

No. I've seen you make one too many assumptions and while I know for a fact that both Galliani and Berlusconi while saying certain things.. the exact opposite happens. The reason they are saying what they are is to prevent disruptions in the team.

You still didn't respond to my other point. You seem so eager to spend money that isn't yours.

the question to me is not what requires a answer I am a afan and i expect milan to sign a defender after last season while the main 2 person are speaking quite opposite anyway this is not an issue of a debate maybe if i had money i would have spent on milan

Galliani and Berlusconi lie to the media. FACT. (Thanks Porty!)

None of it is our money, we don't really contribute more than maybe a few euros every season when we buy jerseys. But it's unfair to say, you can have an opinion on the club's running only if you have a direct stake in it. Since Milan is not like Barca where you can actually be a card holding member and vote for your leaders, almost all of us are under the hammer of a benevolent dictatorship under Finninvest. Both of you are right, since it's not our money, we shouldn't work up an aneurysm. But just because it's not our money, we shouldn't toe the corporate line meekly either. That would be against everything Milan stood for. We're leftist and proud of it.

Now you still have an ideological divide, I suggest you guys accept it as an impasse or head over to Arcade and challenge yourselves to a duel over Pacman. You don't want Tennie to put some Siamese fighter fish into her fish tank.

Didn't mean to interfere in your discussion, but for the past month or so, since v2 came along, MF has become a very pleasant place, and I would hate for it to go back to being a war zone. Discuss not argue...thanks very much!

Sometimes Berlusconi words are of his temporary judgements , because all of the transfer works are on Galliani shoulders and also sometimes Berlusconi words are for market changing as for Ronaldinho .

Thank you for being a voice of reason, Jack. This is indeed a place to debate, not to argue. I hope everyone keeps this in mind and remembers to respect the opinions of others even if they do not agree with them.

The fish doll awards Jack one cookie.

We are not shareholders but we are certainly stakeholders. Everything the club does affects us. They have an ethical duty to act with fans interests at heart (dosent have to be top priority all the time). You are right we at Milanfan dont contribute too much but the ultra's certainly do. Season tickets, Merchandise etc etc. That does bring in some money which is re-appropriated by the club and pays for like 3 minutes of Kaka's salary

But seriously, i think most Serie A teams look out for their fans, as the clubs know they are nothing without them. As for Berlusconi's comments; he is a known eccentric and extravagant. I think it was done to raise confidence in he current defence. Imagine him saying that our defence was poor, how would that affect Bonera's and Janku's confidence (for example)

I am sure Galliani is working behind the line to bring in a CB. If he can accomplish this is another matter. Because of that i will b!tch about whether or not we get a CB after the window closes

The current stories going the rounds in the Italian media talk about Juve and Milan fighting it out for Ivanovic. The media doesn't seem convinced by Berlusconi's comments at all. Ivanovic has supposedly expressed a preference for Milan, but now that Juve are also in need of a good CB, it could be an interesting competition.

I saw on tuttomercatoweb that Lazio might be interested in Brocchi.

I hope this deal goes through.

Stendardo with brocci as soooooooooooooooon as possible