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William405
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 11 2015, 01:32 AM) *
We're going for 18M Euros to try to boost our bids for other players such as Witsel and Romagnoli.

Add getting in Ibra and getting rid of a waste of 4 years of our time in El-Sha?

I cannot say yes more strongly to this deal.


Well, when you put it that way..can't say I disagree. We have simply too many forwards, and he's been incredibly underwhelming for a while now.
William405
QUOTE (Forza Milan! @ Jul 11 2015, 04:22 AM) *
FWIW, it sounds like some players are attracted by Mancini. Personally, I am not impressed by him. IMHO, the scudetti he won at Inter were more the result of Calciopoli then his ability, and he has not done much since. In particular, I feel he had a great opportunity at City and squandered it. Also, he has not done much for Inter since he has returned. But, whatever ...


Yeah, really it's mind boggling. He's a known coach, but actually has done very little to show for it.
han2503
QUOTE (Forza Milan! @ Jul 11 2015, 02:22 AM) *
FWIW, it sounds like some players are attracted by Mancini. Personally, I am not impressed by him. IMHO, the scudetti he won at Inter were more the result of Calciopoli then his ability, and he has not done much since. In particular, I feel he had a great opportunity at City and squandered it. Also, he has not done much for Inter since he has returned. But, whatever ...

Whether we actually rate Mancini or not (I think he's just decent), he's a fairly big name in football. He's won titles and cup competitions in 2 big leagues (no matter how they came about). And let's face it, he's simply a bigger draw than Mihajlovic, who imo was a mistake. You simply do not leave an ambitious project like the one we're undertaking in the hands of someone like Mihajlovic.

The only big coach we looked at was Carlo, once that door was closed for us we appointed the first available easy target out of Serie A.

And of course this matters to players. Kondogbia just made it very clear what swayed his decision. Mancini talked to him and convinced him about Inter, simple as that.

Anyway, this is crying over spilt milk, but the fact that we don't have CL football or a renowned coach who's not even a well-liked figure has/will hurt us when trying to convince players to join
William405
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 11 2015, 10:04 AM) *
Whether we actually rate Mancini or not (I think he's just decent), he's a fairly big name in football. He's won titles and cup competitions in 2 big leagues (no matter how they came about). And let's face it, he's simply a bigger draw than Mihajlovic, who imo was a mistake. You simply do not leave an ambitious project like the one we're undertaking in the hands of someone like Mihajlovic.

The only big coach we looked at was Carlo, once that door was closed for us we appointed the first available easy target out of Serie A.

And of course this matters to players. Kondogbia just made it very clear what swayed his decision. Mancini talked to him and convinced him about Inter, simple as that.

Anyway, this is crying over spilt milk, but the fact that we don't have CL football or a renowned coach who's not even a well-liked figure has/will hurt us when trying to convince players to join


No, it wasn't only Carlo whom we went after. There was Emery(who stated recently why he rejected Napoli/Milan), and we were linked with some others.

At least we don't have a total rookie for a coach this time. Mihajlovic is still far from being a mistake IMO. He's done well with what he's been given, now is the time to see if he can emulate his work for the big clubs. I understand that there might be some bitterness because we lost a player because of not having a big name coach, but I think that's NOT always the case. Most of the time if the money is there, it's ALMOST always a done deal.

Let's not forget Galliani is a big name in the football world too, and he has convinced several of our new players to join.
han2503
QUOTE (William405 @ Jul 11 2015, 08:53 AM) *
No, it wasn't only Carlo whom we went after. There was Emery(who stated recently why he rejected Napoli/Milan), and we were linked with some others.

At least we don't have a total rookie for a coach this time. Mihajlovic is still far from being a mistake IMO. He's done well with what he's been given, now is the time to see if he can emulate his work for the big clubs. I understand that there might be some bitterness because we lost a player because of not having a big name coach, but I think that's NOT always the case. Most of the time if the money is there, it's ALMOST always a done deal.

Let's not forget Galliani is a big name in the football world too, and he has convinced several of our new players to join.

Emery might have been an option, we don't know, and we might have approached him but Carlo is the one we made the real effort for imo.

Then we looked waaay down the pecking order of coaches and took the easy option with Miha. A coach who's never really achieved anything aside from one decent season with Samp, he failed with Serbia and with Fiorentina.

Yes, the fact that we don't have an amateur coaching us is an improvement, but it's still not saying much is it?

Players usually first look at the money, then CL football, then the coach/staff they'll be working with in that order. I don't know if we really have the money, we certainly don't have CL football and Mihajlovic isn't really an appealing coach like say Carlo would have been, or even Mancini.
Fillipo Simone
Yes, agreed. May I just add that the Emery contact certainly was real.
han2503
QUOTE (Fillipo Simone @ Jul 11 2015, 10:14 AM) *
Yes, agreed. May I just add that the Emery contact certainly was real.

Yeah, like I said, we probably made contact with him, but were we really very serious or just felt him out?

Gazzetta and Pedulla saying the fee is 16m for SES, have to say, that takes away a bit of its lustre, we should have tried to sell Menez for that amount not SES.

I hope we included a buy back clause at least. Would hate to see him going to one of the Spanish clubs for big money in the future when we sold him for just 16m. At least 20m made it look like a good deal for us
han2503
Sky reports that Monaco will pay €2m to loan El Shaarawy with a €15m buy-out clause that becomes mandatory after 15 matches.

Like I said, we're doing these guys a solid since they're strapped for cash. We should have tried to go in for Moutinho with a small amount of cash and offered SES in the deal. At least we'd have come out with a better deal.

17m for SES isn't all that good considering we paid 20m for Bertolacci
han2503
Btw, if he gets injured, then good luck trying to get him on the field 15 times. He could be back after this. So this certainly wasn't to get a cash injection for our budget...
Danny
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 11 2015, 10:50 AM) *
Sky reports that Monaco will pay €2m to loan El Shaarawy with a €15m buy-out clause that becomes mandatory after 15 matches.

Like I said, we're doing these guys a solid since they're strapped for cash. We should have tried to go in for Moutinho with a small amount of cash and offered SES in the deal. At least we'd have come out with a better deal.

17m for SES isn't all that good considering we paid 20m for Bertolacci


It's 17M more than he's worth.

As for the clause, they're wise to put it in. He needs to prove his fitness and they're within their rights to test him first. He can pass a medical but can he pass the rigours of match football?

Thankfully Ligue 1 is milder than Serie A so it could actually be ok.
han2503
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 11 2015, 02:12 PM) *
It's 17M more than he's worth.

As for the clause, they're wise to put it in. He needs to prove his fitness and they're within their rights to test him first. He can pass a medical but can he pass the rigours of match football?

Thankfully Ligue 1 is milder than Serie A so it could actually be ok.

You make him sound like a 40 year old couch potato who's never run a mile in his life.

SES has had his injury issues, but that's not like the rest of our players haven't. DS, Abate, Alex, SES, Montolivo have all come off seasons where they've spent more time our injured than fit, not to mention all the other random injuries that keep occurring in our squad. We rarely ever have a fully fit side, and this has been going on for years now.

It's a fact that all the young players we've had that played regular football in our team have suffered an endless cycle of injuries so this can't just be coincidence.

And yes, in this market SES is at least worth 20m, considering we paid 20m for Bertolacci who's had just as much good months in Serie A as SES.

I seriously do hope that Galliani will make swift moves for Ibra and Witsel or Romangoli this month because the majority of Milan fans will be livid by this
William405
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 11 2015, 01:50 PM) *
Sky reports that Monaco will pay €2m to loan El Shaarawy with a €15m buy-out clause that becomes mandatory after 15 matches.

Like I said, we're doing these guys a solid since they're strapped for cash. We should have tried to go in for Moutinho with a small amount of cash and offered SES in the deal. At least we'd have come out with a better deal.

17m for SES isn't all that good considering we paid 20m for Bertolacci


Nah, I think it's more than good enough. He's been plagued injuries, that kind of thing hits the market value pretty hard. Remember Pato? We let go of him for a meager sum.
William405
http://www.football-italia.net/69036/menez-part-witsel-move

Menez might be included into the Witsel move. Yes please, if true.
rip
QUOTE (William405 @ Jul 11 2015, 02:45 PM) *
http://www.football-italia.net/69036/menez-part-witsel-move

Menez might be included into the Witsel move. Yes please, if true.

This is the best transfer news I have heard this summer
Danny
QUOTE (William405 @ Jul 11 2015, 01:45 PM) *
http://www.football-italia.net/69036/menez-part-witsel-move

Menez might be included into the Witsel move. Yes please, if true.


I'm actually about to cry with joy over the news from the past two days.
Danny
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 11 2015, 01:31 PM) *
You make him sound like a 40 year old couch potato who's never run a mile in his life.


No I don't.

Your stubborness is getting a little tiring Han. I mean that with respect.
X-Offender
If we part ways with both SES and Menez we'll be left with no second strikers, so Ibra's return becomes a must at that point.
Danny
QUOTE (X-Offender @ Jul 11 2015, 02:41 PM) *
If we part ways with both SES and Menez we'll be left with no second strikers, so Ibra's return becomes a must at that point.


We don't need a SS in a partnership. Just two different strikers; AKA Adriano and Bacca. If you mean behind them, then I wouldn't want Menez or SES there anyway. Witsel/Ibra would be perfect. Imagine the depth though; Bacca, Adriano, Witsel and Ibra.
Forza Milan!
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 11 2015, 10:11 AM) *
Emery might have been an option, we don't know, and we might have approached him but Carlo is the one we made the real effort for imo.

Then we looked waaay down the pecking order of coaches and took the easy option with Miha. A coach who's never really achieved anything aside from one decent season with Samp, he failed with Serbia and with Fiorentina.

Yes, the fact that we don't have an amateur coaching us is an improvement, but it's still not saying much is it?

Players usually first look at the money, then CL football, then the coach/staff they'll be working with in that order. I don't know if we really have the money, we certainly don't have CL football and Mihajlovic isn't really an appealing coach like say Carlo would have been, or even Mancini.

I think we need to give Miha a chance. He may not have the same appeal as Mancini, but may not be that bad. (And frankly, I would not want Mancini as a coach. Let's see what he does with the players he got.)
han2503
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 11 2015, 03:36 PM) *
No I don't.

Your stubborness is getting a little tiring Han. I mean that with respect.

"but can he pass the rigours of match football?"

It's not like he's never played a full match before...

So if I don't agree with someone I'm the stubborn one but the other person isn't? rolleyes.gif

QUOTE (Forza Milan! @ Jul 11 2015, 04:16 PM) *
I think we need to give Miha a chance. He may not have the same appeal as Mancini, but may not be that bad. (And frankly, I would not want Mancini as a coach. Let's see what he does with the players he got.)

I'm not saying that I won't give him a chance. But he's certainly not someone I've ever wanted associated with Milan, let alone been my first choice for coach.



Menez + 20m for Witsel should be more than enough. Just do it!!

If Juve sell one of their mids, expect them to go in for him (as per his agent's words) so we better get a move on this ASAP
Fillipo Simone
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 11 2015, 01:50 PM) *
Sky reports that Monaco will pay €2m to loan El Shaarawy with a €15m buy-out clause that becomes mandatory after 15 matches.

Like I said, we're doing these guys a solid since they're strapped for cash. We should have tried to go in for Moutinho with a small amount of cash and offered SES in the deal. At least we'd have come out with a better deal.

17m for SES isn't all that good considering we paid 20m for Bertolacci

I really don't think Moutinho is for sale. Also, I hear some of the 20m for Bertolacci might have something to do with our previous Destro deal. Not sure if it's only speculation or something more serious.

QUOTE (X-Offender @ Jul 11 2015, 05:41 PM) *
If we part ways with both SES and Menez we'll be left with no second strikers, so Ibra's return becomes a must at that point.

Indeed.
X-Offender
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 11 2015, 03:48 PM) *
We don't need a SS in a partnership. Just two different strikers; AKA Adriano and Bacca. If you mean behind them, then I wouldn't want Menez or SES there anyway. Witsel/Ibra would be perfect. Imagine the depth though; Bacca, Adriano, Witsel and Ibra.


Huh, of course we do. Partnerships are when second strikers are actually needed. You need one pure CF or poacher (Adriano, Bacca) and a SS or "forward of movement" as they say in Italian, like Tevez, Menez, Ibra etc. With just Bacca and Adriano we're left with two strikers with similar characteristics that will step on each-others feet than anything else.
han2503
QUOTE (Fillipo Simone @ Jul 11 2015, 04:32 PM) *
I really don't think Moutinho is for sale. Also, I hear some of the 20m for Bertolacci might have something to do with our previous Destro deal. Not sure if it's only speculation or something more serious.

Don't know, I did read that it had something to do with keeping a good relationship with Roma, but I just don't think 20m for him was a good deal.

Like I said, Monaco have financial issues atm. Anyone is for sale as their owner has decided to stop funnelling cash into the club. That's why they're fielding offers for all of their players.

QUOTE (X-Offender @ Jul 11 2015, 04:56 PM) *
Huh, of course we do. Partnerships are when second strikers are actually needed. You need one pure CF or poacher (Adriano, Bacca) and a SS or "forward of movement" as they say in Italian, like Tevez, Menez, Ibra etc. With just Bacca and Adriano we're left with two strikers with similar characteristics that will step on each-others feet than anything else.

Agreed, especially if we have no pure creator in that mid, which is looking less and less likely by the day that we'll go for someone in that mould

Remember the Gila-Pippo disaster after Sheva left? That's one experiment that had failure written all over it before it was even attempted
Danny
*ignore
Danny
*ignore
han2503
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 11 2015, 08:32 PM) *
*ignore

QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 11 2015, 08:38 PM) *
*ignore

QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 11 2015, 08:44 PM) *
*ignore

Were you going to write me a retaliating post and decided against it? biggrin.gif


Or did your clicker get stuck? happy.gif
Danny
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 11 2015, 08:19 PM) *
Were you going to write me a retaliating post and decided against it? biggrin.gif


Or did your clicker get stuck? happy.gif


I realised I can't be bothered arguing. Better things to do. I'd rather discuss Milan on here, not get bogged down in idiotic arguments.
han2503
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 11 2015, 09:31 PM) *
I realised I can't be bothered arguing. Better things to do. I'd rather discuss Milan on here, not get bogged down in idiotic arguments.

Well we are all discussing Milan, just because we don't agree and don't bow down on our opinions, it doesn't make either one of us stubborn

Anyway, mediaset reporting that we'll offer Zenit 15m plus Menez for Witsel

personally, I can't see them biting on that one, they want 30m for the guy and aren't in any rush to sell
Danny
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 11 2015, 08:39 PM) *
Well we are all discussing Milan, just because we don't agree and don't bow down on our opinions, it doesn't make either one of us stubborn

Anyway, mediaset reporting that we'll offer Zenit 15m plus Menez for Witsel

personally, I can't see them biting on that one, they want 30m for the guy and aren't in any rush to sell


I don't trust MS.

I'm hoping we offer 20M and Menez. As for Witsel, he wants to leave. And we all know how ignominious it gets for a club when a player (Sterling) wants to leave.
han2503
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 11 2015, 10:27 PM) *
I don't trust MS.

I'm hoping we offer 20M and Menez. As for Witsel, he wants to leave. And we all know how ignominious it gets for a club when a player (Sterling) wants to leave.

It depends on whether or not the player is being a d!ck about the entire situation though - like Sterling

Anyway his Italian intermediary has said that there will be more meeti.gs between all parties involved on Monday and Tuesday, so hopefully things move along by then

20m + Menez is more than enough, but apparently Zenit want 30 - 35m

Agazzi to Real is official apparently, which is just strange. But hey, at least he's off our books

Gabriel will most liky be loaned to Napoli which is pointless imo when he won't get first team action there and Carpi want him for another year. But apparently it's where he wants to go
X-Offender
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 11 2015, 10:37 PM) *
Agazzi to Real is official apparently, which is just strange.


Wait, what? blink.gif
William405
Agazzi to Real? Are you on something Han? laugh.gif laugh.gif
han2503
Didn't you hear? He'll be taking Casillas' spot biggrin.gif

Ignore me, saw it on twitter yesterday, it was a hoax, must have been too tired to read the replies
William405
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 12 2015, 09:29 AM) *
Didn't you hear? He'll be taking Casillas' spot biggrin.gif

Ignore me, saw it on twitter yesterday, it was a hoax, must have been too tired to read the replies


Hahahahahh biggrin.gif
han2503
Pedulla from Gazzetta has said that next week will be an important one for the Romagnoli, Ibra deals. While Corriere is saying that we'll try to close as quickly as possible for Witsel and Romagnoli next week.

So I'm expecting something to happen next week with 1 or 2 of these 3

SES has apparently left Milanello (yesterday) and will do medicals on Monday. 2m straight up for the loan, and an extra 16m when he makes 15 appearances next season.
X-Offender
Alright, here's a good question: has anyone seen this Romagnoli kid play before? How good is he? Personally, I had never heard of him until he started being linked with us. Apparently our last offer to Roma was 18 million plus bonuses, which IMO is A LOT for someone as unproven as him, yet Roma are asking 30 frigging million instead. Is it me or are they just pulling our leg here? They know we've got lots of money now so they're trying to squeeze as much as possible from the deal. If they don't accept 20 million I'd tell them to f*ck off and focus on someone else instead.
han2503
QUOTE (X-Offender @ Jul 12 2015, 09:42 AM) *
Alright, here's a good question: has anyone seen this Romagnoli kid play before? How good is he? Personally, I had never heard of him until he started being linked with us. Apparently our last offer to Roma was 18 million plus bonuses, which IMO is A LOT for someone as unproven as him, yet Roma are asking 30 frigging million instead. Is it me or are they just pulling our leg here? They know we've got lots of money now so they're trying to squeeze as much as possible from the deal. If they don't accept 20 million I'd tell them to f*ck off and focus on someone else instead.

I think he's regarded as the best young defender coming out of Italy right now.

Is he worth 30m? No f@cking way. And the 20m we offered is more than fair imo. How much did Benatia go for last summer? 24m? It would be ridiculous to pay anything more than that for a player who isn't half as good as Benatia currently. Maybe he has a higher ceiling of potential but he's not a ready made product

I think we're waiting things out because the player wants to come, he's not going to be a starter at Roma while Mihajlovic will guarantee him that at Milan. Plus he has a history with Miha after their time at Samp so that's another plus.

Anything above 25m and we should look elsewhere imo. Laporte's buy-out clause is 50m apparently so that's beyond us. Maksimovic is also good and most likely Toro will ask for half of the sum that Roma want.
Danny
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 12 2015, 08:51 AM) *
I think he's regarded as the best young defender coming out of Italy right now.

Is he worth 30m?


Doesn't that answer itself?

In terms of worth, no players are 'worth' these sums. But the market value would suggest a brilliant young player is always priced at that level.
han2503
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 12 2015, 10:04 AM) *
Doesn't that answer itself?

In terms of worth, no players are 'worth' these sums. But the market value would suggest a brilliant young player is always priced at that level.

I think 20m is a much more fair evaluation for someone that could just as easily turn into another Ranocchia or Astori. Because these guys were regarded as the best Italy had to offer a few years ago and they turned out far and away from being what they were hyped as.

It's always a gamble with young players, he's only had one season where he's been a starter for a Serie A side. 30m is what I would pay for a finished product, not someone who's just a prospect
Danny
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 12 2015, 09:19 AM) *
I think 20m is a much more fair evaluation for someone that could just as easily turn into another Ranocchia or Astori. Because these guys were regarded as the best Italy had to offer a few years ago and they turned out far and away from being what they were hyped as.

It's always a gamble with young players, he's only had one season where he's been a starter for a Serie A side. 30m is what I would pay for a finished product, not someone who's just a prospect


Doesn't matter that they 'could' be a dud. You're paying for the best-case scenario, and if a youngster produces it now, they fetch serious cash.

Young English, Italian and Spanish players are glorious for this. Furthermore, you said it yourself - a full season as a first-choice starter for Roma?

24-year old Bertolacci cost us 20M. Someone who has 4 or 5 years on him and has had a stellar season? Sadly, they cost even more.
Danny
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 12 2015, 08:51 AM) *
I think he's regarded as the best young defender coming out of Italy right now.

Is he worth 30m? No f@cking way. And the 20m we offered is more than fair imo. How much did Benatia go for last summer? 24m?


He's Moroccan. That was about right for a Moroccan who's top class. It's Romagnoli's nationality that counts in Roma's favour re: his value. He's also an OAP by comparison. 28.

These all explain why Benatia's value is less than Romagnoli's.

Not saying it's fair, or that I agree with it, I'm just explaining the reasons.
han2503
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 12 2015, 11:13 AM) *
Doesn't matter that they 'could' be a dud. You're paying for the best-case scenario, and if a youngster produces it now, they fetch serious cash.

Young English, Italian and Spanish players are glorious for this. Furthermore, you said it yourself - a full season as a first-choice starter for Roma?

24-year old Bertolacci cost us 20M. Someone who has 4 or 5 years on him and has had a stellar season? Sadly, they cost even more.

He was a starter at Samp on loan under Miha

Don't know, but unless a player is a super talent, 30m is too much for someone who's young and inexperienced, no matter what their nationality is.

A player's price I think is defined by certain criteria, how important he is to his current team, his form based on the past season played, age, attributes and last nationality could factor but not as much as you say.

Would a club really care if it's getting an Italian/English/Spanish p[layer vs a Maroccan one when the latter has shown that he is one of the top CBs in a top European league? Hardly imo.

If Darmian costs 18m, than Romagnoli at best is 10m. Both Italian, Darmian is still young especially for a defender and currently considered a lot better than Romagnoli. Roma just want to try to bleed us dry because they don't have the cash they need to complete all the moves they want to make (Dzeko especially)

QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 12 2015, 11:15 AM) *
He's Moroccan. That was about right for a Moroccan who's top class. It's Romagnoli's nationality that counts in Roma's favour re: his value. He's also an OAP by comparison. 28.

These all explain why Benatia's value is less than Romagnoli's.

Not saying it's fair, or that I agree with it, I'm just explaining the reasons.

I understand that talents from Italy, England and Spain tend to go for slightly a bit more. But being from another nationality doesn't diminish the price of a player especially if he's a quality one like Benatia.

Also have to add, that my initial argument is tainted since now I remember that Benatia pushed his way out of Roma and Sabatini initially wanted a lot more for him than they got because Benatia was being an @sshole.

However I do think Romagnoli wants to join us so wecould also use that as an advantage
Danny
No it doesn't, but it does explain why younger players cost more.

Can you tell me the last excellent young Italian, Spanish or English player to go for less than 25M?
han2503
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 12 2015, 01:20 PM) *
No it doesn't, but it does explain why younger players cost more.

Can you tell me the last excellent young Italian, Spanish or English player to go for less than 25M?

Darmian? Verratti? Isco?

English players are ridiculously overpriced and overhyped. But off the top of my head, Lallana I think went for something like 20m and he was one of the most hyped English players next to Barkley and Sterling in the EPL before his move. Talking about Sterling, there is no way that this guy is worth 50m. Talk about overhyped and overpriced. But he's considered as one of those super talents so he's an exception rather than the rule

Like I said, I think 20m for a prospect, even one from those 3 major countries, is fair (in this market because it's still a ridiculous amount to pay on a gamble). 30m is not a price that you'd pay for someone who's just promising and a young talent, you pay 30m for someone who's established
han2503
Also, people balked at the Luke Shaw transfer for 26m and he's regarded as one of the best young English players around. And you know how much they over hype their players. So it's really not normal to throw around 30m for a young player that's only really done it for a season and can still turn into a dud.
Danny
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 12 2015, 01:11 PM) *
Darmian? Verratti? Isco?


Isco was £24M. That's about 32M Euros.

I give you Verratti, but then Verratti wasn't hyped massively till his displays at PSG - and Pescara couldn't reasonably demand 30M.

Darmian is 25 and not a 'prospect'.

QUOTE
English players are ridiculously overpriced and overhyped. But off the top of my head, Lallana I think went for something like 20m and he was one of the most hyped English players next to Barkley and Sterling in the EPL before his move. Talking about Sterling, there is no way that this guy is worth 50m. Talk about overhyped and overpriced. But he's considered as one of those super talents so he's an exception rather than the rule


35M Euros for Lallana.

QUOTE
Like I said, I think 20m for a prospect, even one from those 3 major countries, is fair (in this market because it's still a ridiculous amount to pay on a gamble). 30m is not a price that you'd pay for someone who's just promising and a young talent, you pay 30m for someone who's established


Illarramendi - barely 23, cost £34M, that's 45-50M Euros.

So, no you don't. You pay what you're willing to, and what the recipient demands. And it's usually a compromise on market value.
Danny
QUOTE (han2503 @ Jul 12 2015, 01:18 PM) *
Also, people balked at the Luke Shaw transfer for 26m and he's regarded as one of the best young English players around. And you know how much they over hype their players. So it's really not normal to throw around 30m for a young player that's only really done it for a season and can still turn into a dud.


Er, what? Luke Shaw is NOT regarded as one of the best young English players around!

The fee was baulked at BECAUSE he's seen as mildly above average.
han2503
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 12 2015, 03:20 PM) *
Isco was £24M. That's about 32M Euros.

I give you Verratti, but then Verratti wasn't hyped massively till his displays at PSG - and Pescara couldn't reasonably demand 30M.

Darmian is 25 and not a 'prospect'.

None of these guys I'm mentioning are teenagers. I think Darmian qualifies. Also the fact that he's not only just a prospect but a full fledged NT player who has tons of top flight experience at just the age of 25 should make him even more expensive than just a prospect.

Nah, he was hyped up at Pescara just as much as Insigne, however none of the Italian clubs were willing to pay for him because of the usual backwards mentality of Italian football that older is better and younger shouldn't be starting. Now he's lost forever to the Italian league imo, I seriously cannot see him playing in Serie A anytime in the near or distant future.

I'm sure had Pescara really tightened their hold they would have squeezed a crazy number out of PSG, but again, it's the mentality in Italian football that youngsters aren't really worth all that much, not until they reach a certain age.

QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 12 2015, 03:20 PM) *
35M Euros for Lallana.

Thought he went for less, this mainly proves that English players are ridiculously over priced. In what reality is this guy worth 35m?

QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 12 2015, 03:20 PM) *
Illarramendi - barely 23, cost £34M, that's 45-50M Euros.

So, no you don't. You pay what you're willing to, and what the recipient demands. And it's usually a compromise on market value.

Real over inflating prices as usual for a player who's barely had any first team action. All that is wrong in football right there.

Anyway, I think what this all proves is that it's the English and Spanish that are over priced as you say. Italian players aren't. Why? Because clubs are usually willing to jump at any decent fee offered to them. Look at Toro. They could have easily held out for at least 25m for Darmian, one of the best in his positions around right now imo. Yet, they jump on the 18m because every club in the league is desperate for cash.

Same with Verratti really. You think a club in Germany or Spain, no matter how small or poor they are would allow a talent like Verratti to go for the fee that he did?

So you're right about one bit that Spanish and English talent is overpriced but I don't agree that it's the same with the Italians. Which brings us back to Romagnoli. There is no way this guy is worth 30m, no matter if this market is over inflated and he's Italian.

20m is already stretching it way too much imo

Like I said, if Darmian is worth 18m, this guy at best is 10m
Danny
He has 6 years on Darmian.

I'm not repeating my point again.

Let's just end this one now!
han2503
QUOTE (Danny @ Jul 12 2015, 03:45 PM) *
He has 6 years on Darmian.

I'm not repeating my point again.

Let's just end this one now!

Who? Romagnoli?

He's 20, that means Darmian is the one who has 5 years on him. Which should make him even more expensive, especially considering that Darmian has much more experience in top flight football, is at a great age and is a NT player. Romagnoli has a few months of good displays in Serie A and he should be worth more? How is that logical?


Anyways, Witsel about to play in the Russian Super Cup game n about 10 minutes. Could be his last game for them and probably why Monday and Tuesday are important days for negotiations
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