what is the likely outcome? 3 games and a fine?

Crouch is 6ft 7 Why would he need to use any other elevation to jump over a small man like Gattuso? Crouch did nothing wrong all game to be fair.

Yes Jordan must have said something but that was because Gattuso was running around like a raving lunatic. Of course Jordan takes some of the blame, but the way Gattuso behaved was nothing short of atrocious.

Spurs played a dirty game? Compared to Flamini's tackle, Gattuso etc? Seriously you were talking about bias last night yet this post is clearly just as biased in our favour. I only remember one bad tackle from spurs foot a little high on Gattuso apart from that I didn't see anything else that was particularly wrong.

Na, I remember them both having a go in the 2nd half. It was Gattuso, Crouch, Gattuso, Crouch, Gattuso, yellow card or something like that. Point being Spurs had a plan to work Rino up and they stuck to it.

It was because Gattuso kept running upto him. One point Crouch made a tackle, Gattuso fell over then ran straight up to him. Crouch was practically laughing at him.

I'm sorry but I don't buy it, we were a dirty, dirty side last night and that's what the media all over the world are branding us. Thanks to a couple of individuals out there.

It will take a long time for the club's image to get over this, believe that.

Unfortunately, most people only remember the very last thing that happened.


I don't think he's ever been worse than last night. I'll be very disappointed to see him wear the armband again.


I don't think Flamini and Gattuso were dirty... they were unsportsmanlike, awful and stupid but not dirty... dirty was what Palacios and Sandro were doing all game long but it was still stuff that happens in most games. All in all, I think Tottenham played a fair game and did nothing so bad that could justify Gattuso's behavior.

Are you serious about the first bit? I have a clear image in my head of crouch jumping over Rino digging his elbows and knees into him. And Crouch was having a go at him just as much.

What does that have to do with anything? Joe Jordan shouldn't be getting anywhere near the players, last time I checked coaches shouldn't come out of their technical area to mouth off, we've seen them getting crds for that. Also you chose to defend him for not doing anything, but what he did could be worse, because he did it under the radar like the little girl in the playground that pulls hair and pinches others from behind because she's too chicken sh!t. Sorry but he was just at fault.

Playing a dirty game doesn't always have to be going in with rough tackles. Sure Flamini went in badly but it's not like he was trying to take off his legs, we've seen those types of tackles before, Flamini actually got the ball first, it was terrible because he went in 2 footed and hurt him but his intention was to get the ball. Imo what you're talking about is a rough game, not a dirty game, and Spurs played a dirty game, point being Crouch and Sandro and Palacios with how they kept making those niggling fouls on every occasion they could get, trying to get under the players skin.

Bias? I'm talking about what I saw going on the pitch last night, sorry but Tottenham weren't walking angels that's for sure, there was a reason why the majority of our players were getting so p!ssed off last night during the 2nd half, when we started to dominate Spurs started acting like spoiled brats.


Exactly

Really, really? I mean wow.

If I saw Crouch go headbutt Allegri last night, and saw Sandro go double footed on Robinho and practically break his ankle I'd be going mad and calling them dirty.

It's ok though because we are the mighty Milan, our history means we're fine to do this.

There's no point me trying anymore, the worlds media has spoken and quite frankly I agree with them. Some people are just too blinkered to realise how much this has tarnished our reputation.

I remember the laugh. Very vividly.


So very true. Like I said we gave them fodder, and they will run with it. Even if the team was losing 0-1 or the result was not coming, they should have kept their cool. Most guys did, but a few instances really hurt us. I will be watching both Roma and Arsenal's match later today in a cafe, let's hope it is a much better affair.


Sadly, yes. Not sure about the long time though, we do seem to have a few new characters on board. This Milan is very, very different than the one in the "Age of Maldini". This team is different. We sneak out minutes at the corned flag toward the end, for crying out loud.


Agreed. Me and my mates who were on for the match were saying that Spurs were doing tactical fouls, everything they did had a reason behind it. And guess what, they walked away with an away goal at the end.


True. There was a reason to their madness. It was a lucky break for the goal, but Tottenham knew that they can't take us head on (not away, and a few of their main players injured or returning from injury), so they did what had to. Smart? Yes. Ugly? You bet. But we fell right into their trap. Give me a 0-1 loss any day, as opposed to the theatrical show during and after the match.

Besides, it was just one single away goal. It's not like we conceded 3 or 4 and ended the tie there and then.

Like I said, if you condone the pulling pigtails from behind tactic then all the best for you. But it was clear what Tottenham were trying to do. The only thing I'm p!ssed off about is Rino being dumb enough to fall into the trap. Personally I've seen him doing things that were worse.

Flamini's tackle? Personally I saw it as him going for the ball. Did he go in badly? Yes! But there is a huge difference between going into a tackle to hurt someone and going in with the intention to win the ball and doing it badly enough to hurt someone. How many times do we see Flamini doing this? Again, it's a repeat yet now we're suddenly going up in arms about it. Every week we used to complain about how Flamini needs to tone it down with the tackling, he probably did something similar to this on the weekend, but again with blowing it out of proportion.

Oh please! Tarnished our reputation? We've seen so many more terrible things being done in football, but this is the end of the world. Imo tacking it out on Rino is unfair when he wasn't completely at fault. Funny how Jordan so far has had nothing to say about it.

Spot on.

I mean they weren't like Holland in the WC final who were breaking up play with all types of horrendous challenges. Of course they were going to try and trip us up though to break up our play. That was always going to happen because they are majorly inferior to us.

It's not dirty in my mind to break up play, not if you're just tripping someone up. To do what Flamini did, or what De Jong did in the WC final, now that is dirty.


Oh please. He was shouting at him from the sideline, what was he meant to do walk up and punch him? It's a game of football, there's always winding up going on. Gattuso just isn't big enough to let it go over his head.


Never said it was the worst thing in football?! Just that this happened on a big stage with a lot of worldwide media watching. Therefore it will tarnish our reputation somewhat. If it were just Gattuso then they'd aim it at him but with Flamini's tackle as well, it just doesn't pend well for us as a club. You have to remember a lot of media don't get to see us week-in, week-out. Before its bought up I'm not just talking about English media, I'm talking about media worldwide.

If your reply was to my post I have to say I did not say that what they did was not dirty to protect them... it's just a matter of definition. I define being dirty as doing sneaky stuff. Imagine Kevin Garnett, doing all the sneaky annoying stuff that he tries to cover up as fair play, that's what I define as dirty. Gattuso and Flamini were not dirty in that sense, they were all guns blazing disgraceful. I hope I'm not misunderstood.

It's certainly not OK exactly because of our history, the armband passing from Maldini to someone that did all that last night... that's pitiful!


Oh come now you're not really saying they won because of Sandro's and Palacios' play! Seriously... you've watched football games before, that was stuff that happens all the time... and our players (should) know better than to lose their cool by something like that.

I agree and that's the most annoying thing about it all. What Gattuso did last night did not stop there, the tag we got will stick for some time!

Talking mostly about the incident when the match ended. Jordan obviously said something to finally burst Rino's bubble.


I think you're putting waaaay to much emphasis on Flamini's tackle. How often do we see those kinds of tackles? at least once a week from different players. I'm sure Flamini pulled off some of the same stuff like this playing at Arsenal, it's not something new out of him.

Well the English media are the International media imo, the English braodcasts are the ones who reach the widest audience, and imo for this to have happened against an English team is what is really bad for us. Because no doubt it is being painted in the worse possible light.

The blame should go both ways, no matter how much you say that Rino is at fault and a crazy nut (but we all knew that before). As a Milan fan, I'm not even mad at him for going for Jordan, because I can;t say myself what I would do myself if someone has been throwing insults at me for an hour straight, I blame him for being stupid enough to fall into that age old trap. But again Rino was never known for his smarts so...

Not at all, far from it. I'm saying that Spurs had a plan to defend in numbers, and frustrate our players. If anything they would have been the happier side with a 0-0 score at the end. Everything went according to plan, and what more they got an away goal against the run of play, partly because of Ibra, partly because our coach was stupid/naive enough to commit men forward even with the slow CB combo we had.

You said it yourself that our players should know better than to lose their cool. And that's what I have been saying all along. Tottenham's visit was a wholesome success, because one, they won; two, they scored an away goal; three, they kept a clean sheet; four, they frustrated our players just like they planned; and five, they won't have to deal with Gattuso in the return leg. The Spurs guys I know term this visit as even more of a success than the the 4-3 against inter.

And for the record, I think we will go out in 3 weeks time. Unless we find a way to counter Tottenham's speed when they play in their own backyard. Or unless some of our guys really step up. Ash said it best, this one is even more difficult than Bayern away 07.

I don't think it's that often that we see such tackles not at this level and not from player in a Milan shirt. The local football level in my town? Yes, way worse stuff. The fact that he was doing that at Arsenal does not justify it in any way...

And it was not just the tackle... it was how he went for it and what he did after that, complaining about time wasting while he could have broken the man's leg!


that's better for us actually.

I said it before, and I'll say it again, two-footed tackles like this should be red card straight. No matter who does them, either from front or behind. If anything, Flamini walked away cheaply, he should consider himself lucky. Ribery got it much worse for something half as bad in the CL last season.

I'm pretty sure it's not as rare as you speak of it. A 2 footed tackle imo is something common. What was terrible about Flamini's tackle was the speed at which he went into it. Don't we see at least 1 player a year getting his leg broken in the EPL over this stuff?

How they reacted after it was obviously bad, and imo that was the terrible part not the tackle in itself.

Come to think of it, yes it will. Provided Ambro and KPB return to full fitness!

Last one I remember as bad as this was the one on Eduardo. Can't think of any other.

That's what I meant in uncommon, a two-footed tackle with such speed, he could have f***** him up pretty badly.

+1.

i agree (

There was the young Arsenal player as well(can't remember his name), and IIRC it screwed his career up!

Regarding Gattuso, I have to agree with both Kurt and Han. I certainly don't condone what Gattuso did and he has done a lot of damage to our club. But Jordan should not have been allowed to stand on the touchline and shout verbal abuse at an opposing player. I would also add that Gattuso did come out and apologise straight after and accepted the blame, while Jordan has sat back and said nothing! I hope the UEFA disciplinary panel punish both Gattuso and Jordan as it takes two to argue.

Oh and Flamini's tackle was terrible but Palacios went unpunished for a thigh high foul on Gattuso(which seemed to be the catalyst for Gattuso losing his head!), so it's not all one way traffic. Bottom line is that Spurs set out to wind us up and it worked, now some might say they played to their strengths but to me it's dirty play. Ironically, had Milan played in the same way as Spurs we wouldn't have heard the last of it(dirty Italians etc! )

Ben Arfa broke his leg this year. But like I said at the time, it was a fluke injury from a good challenge. Barton's tackle on Diaby the other week was exactly the same - yet nobody mentioned the tackle at all. Ben Arfa was just unlucky his stoods were caught in the ground.


If Rino is punished, then Jordan does too, I agree. Apparently 'dirty Italian *******' amongst other things were said to Rino which is out of order. 4th officials really need to report what things are said on the sideline, because it's hardly fair that Rino will probably get into trouble after essentially being racially abused from an opposition coach. I'd have flattened him after the game if I were Rino.

It was clearly nothing to do with being a sore loser either as he shook hands with Harry and others.

Couldn't have said it better myself!


Exactly

Shawcross challenge? Compared to Flamini's last night it was nothing.

the Arsenal player broke his leg in two places! And if I remember correctly Arsene Wenger had to let him go. Flamini's was nowhere near as bad.

Goal.com/en

In terms of intention, it was no where near as bad, it was a 50-50 ball. I'm pretty sure Ramsey has just gone out on loan to a few places, though compared to the rest of Arsenal's midfield he is streets behind anyway. Of course you could judge a tackle on end injury, so that would mean when Irwin and McClair collided with Coventry City player David Busst breaking his leg to the point of near amputation (ending his career) making Schmeichel throw up on the pitch and needing counselling should be kicked out of the game? Even though there was no intention? No.

But Flamini's tackle was hideous, I'm sorry it doesn't take a nasty injury for that sort of tackle to be punished in my mind, those sorts of tackles will break legs. The only thing you hope as the receiving player of it is your legs give way, if your studs/blades plant into the ground you're done for.

I saw the replay many times, I was certain Flamini took the ball. But considering the aftermath, I guess he must have hit Corluka as well.

Of course, he did. Flamini took the ball first fair and square. But that still doesn't take away the fact that he went in with a two-footed tackle. That should be a no-no anywhere and anytime. Straight red. And of course, the players should know it in the back of their head. Not just Flamini, but all professional footballers.

I'd say there was no malice involved in that tackle from Flamini, apparently, but that is still no excuse.

It's not really about getting the ball with this sort of tackle. When you jump in/lunge in, you are not in control of what you're doing, natural momentum takes over. There's no way of stopping yourself when you do this. Let alone when you do it with both feet and showing studs. It's a recipe for disaster.

You do that a few times and you will break someone's leg, at the very least their ankle.

But how did Corluka get injured if Flamini hit the ball? Was it because of the high pressure?

Think he caught him as well as getting the ball.

I'm not sure on Corluka's injury in terms of connection with Flamini it wasn't that bad.

Though as I've said above the tackle was hideous and could easily break someones leg that's the issue here not the end injury.

Flamini/Corluka

There's definitely contact.

Goal.com/en

Ancelotti came out in support of Rino. Also an article in goal.com where they say the English media has gone overboard with the whole "Milanimals" and "Mafiosi" schtick.

Good of Carletto to stick up for his old boy, when the whole of England was up in arms. But I still think his captaincy should be revoked. I'm very displeased with Galliani for saying he can continue as vice captain.

Was it really.

You don't count. You're from some God forsaken place in England that no one even knows exists.

The whole of England

No, one cared about Milan after Wednesday. Everyone's more interested in Arsenal after what they did to Barca and in particular Messi.

Is it just me that believes what he says?

He clearly uttered the F word in Rino's face, but racism? I doubt it.

Nevermind. Rino's actions were a disgrace, nothing else matters.

What he says just sounds like a guilty man to be honest. It's like someone I know is racist and alwas comes out with "how can I be racist, I have a black friend". This just sounds the same as that. He's Scottish too..

I definitely think Joe Jordan should be penalised. My gripe is not with Rino losing his head. It's with Rino the captain of the most decorated squad in the world losing his head.

It's like Roger Federer trying to pick a fight with Murray. Why?? The gulf in class is obvious..yet Rino reduced us from virtual footbaling royalty to being a thuggish team. I can never forgive him for this. I've stuck up for him through thick and thin..and he did this shite that for me is unforgivable.

A tramp on the street has more class than that pr!ck.

Flamini had is studs one side of the ball while Corluka was kicking it, as is Corluka must have just bruised his foot as he'll be ok for the return leg. Gattuso came of much worse from Palacios' thigh high challenge and had to have twelve stitches! Funnily enough that went unpunished...

---- Response


It's not about the end injury. It's like saying Gattuso's headbutt was fine because Jordan didn't get knocked out.

Definitely.

Are you saying these just because he's a Scotsman?

Before that night was there any evidence that he's racist towards Italians?!this is an interview with him before the game. he doesn't sound like the person you make him out to be at all.

The Scottish thing was a joke.

But he does have previous. Pires went to the Spurs sideline earlier this season when Jordan said something to him. Gattuso went to the Spurs sideline when Jordan said something to him. What's the common factor here? Footballers gets abuse from each other/fans all game long, so why would 2 players that've been in the game as long as Pires and Rino react like this? Had we been losing at the time I think maybe it'd be frustration of some sort, but at the time it was 0-0 and we were on top.