QUOTE (Habitant @ Sep 28 2008, 07:15 AM) 
so it's easy to put all the blame on him, but guess what the same thing would happen to kaka or pato if we did the same thing them.
Plain truth.
Top post.
Full Version: Alberto Gilardino
Plain truth.
Top post.
QUOTE (Habitant @ Sep 27 2008, 07:15 PM)
gattuso really shouldnt be talking beucase he hasnt delivered since the world cup.
everything u said is fair game except this part. rino's performance against man u two years ago won us that tie. When he was subbed off man u scored instantly. when he played heroically like he did in the san siro..we demolished man u, largely thanks to rino's snarl and the way he made cristiano his b1tch.
QUOTE (acid911 @ Sep 27 2008, 05:02 PM)
I agree. Though he said something to this effect: “The shirt of Milan weighs heavily, and with all due respect, it weighs much more than that of Fiorentina. To play for Milan you must have great personality.” 
Maybe he meant it in a good way, probably the journalists cranked it up, but all said and done, it's not something I'd like to read again in my life.
Crap or not, Gila is a fellow Italian, after all.
Plus it was bad timing too on Rino's part, gotta admit.
Maybe he meant it in a good way, probably the journalists cranked it up, but all said and done, it's not something I'd like to read again in my life. Crap or not, Gila is a fellow Italian, after all.
Plus it was bad timing too on Rino's part, gotta admit.Considering that he himself has been off form for quite some time now, Gattuso can scarcely afford to make comments like that.
QUOTE (MizNelson @ Sep 28 2008, 10:40 AM)
Considering that he himself has been off form for quite some time now, Gattuso can scarcely afford to make comments like that.
True. Rino's been off-form (I don't even know we can call it this) for exactly an year.
I haven't seen the same guy since the CL semifinal against Man U. In the final he was okay, and from them on it all went downhill for both him and Milan. And then the transfer to Bayern shenanigans a couple of months ago!Having said that, it seems like he's coming back!
Which can never be a bad thing!
"To play for Milan you must have great personality"
Funny Rino should say this really, since World Cup 2006 what exactly has he done? I'd be ashamed to put in the type of performances he has. Maybe you don't have the personality for Milan, Rino? Off to Rangers you go, I'll gladly take you there myself.
Oh, and as for Gila, Boriello has high expectations to live upto in his "first" season in Milan, anyone think he'll reach Gila's 17 goals? I don't think any of our players will to be honest.
Funny Rino should say this really, since World Cup 2006 what exactly has he done? I'd be ashamed to put in the type of performances he has. Maybe you don't have the personality for Milan, Rino? Off to Rangers you go, I'll gladly take you there myself.
Oh, and as for Gila, Boriello has high expectations to live upto in his "first" season in Milan, anyone think he'll reach Gila's 17 goals? I don't think any of our players will to be honest.
QUOTE (Habitant @ Sep 28 2008, 06:45 AM)
gila scored 17 goals when we had serginho and cafu on the wings. two LEGIT wingers that can deliver crosses. it's no secret gilas strong point is his aerial abilities, most of his goals are a result of this. i remember that year serginho was top in serie a for completed crosses, and guess what gila scored. when you change the system ( a christams tree, where he gets the ball mostly to his feet. and impotent fullbacks) , or play players out of position, what esle can you expect? (taking away gila's crosses would be equivalent to playing kaka in the Dm role, or flamini as an attacking mid. what esle would you expect of them then?)
If Gila could only score headers on crosses then we did the right thing to sell him as he was not a complete striker. a complete striker is someone who can perform and score both with his head and with his feet! remember Sheva of old days?... I completely agree that our full backs failed to provide Gila with decent crosses in his last two seasons with us, but I for one won't accept this as an explanation for his goal drought because I still remember the great chances he missed...
QUOTE (vnata001 @ Sep 28 2008, 08:57 AM)
everything
u said is fair game except this part. rino's performance against man u
two years ago won us that tie. When he was subbed off man u scored
instantly. when he played heroically like he did in the san siro..we
demolished man u, largely thanks to rino's snarl and the way he made
cristiano his b1tch.
u said is fair game except this part. rino's performance against man u
two years ago won us that tie. When he was subbed off man u scored
instantly. when he played heroically like he did in the san siro..we
demolished man u, largely thanks to rino's snarl and the way he made
cristiano his b1tch.
+1
IIRC he was even chosen as man of the match. he really truly made CR his b1tch that night!
QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Sep 28 2008, 06:24 PM)
Oh, and as for Gila, Boriello has high expectations to live upto in his "first" season in Milan, anyone think he'll reach Gila's 17 goals? I don't think any of our players will to be honest.
I don't know about that Kurt,I really have a good feeling that someone in orange shoes will.
^^
They're not orange anymore, they're white. now he's really Pato Branco especially when we're the away team.
They may or may not reach 17 league goals, but thing is they have been scoring some important goals so far.
I really would like to see Gila's record in his first season with us again as I remember most of his goals came when the game had already been killed off. he was good in quantity, but in quality? not THAT spectacular as he rarely managed to score winners or against big sides that season.
Besides, what about his 0 goal in the very same season in the CL? our full backs' assists were there in the league but not in the CL??? how can someone justify that?... that's one of the reasons I still think his biggest problem was this big club pressure thing, NOT our style of play. he delivered in the league but in the CL... he just couldn't cut it. this failure later came back to haunt him even in the league.
They're not orange anymore, they're white. now he's really Pato Branco
especially when we're the away team.QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Sep 28 2008, 01:54 PM)
Oh, and as for Gila, Boriello has high expectations to live upto in his "first" season in Milan, anyone think he'll reach Gila's 17 goals? I don't think any of our players will to be honest.
They may or may not reach 17 league goals, but thing is they have been scoring some important goals so far.
I really would like to see Gila's record in his first season with us again as I remember most of his goals came when the game had already been killed off. he was good in quantity, but in quality? not THAT spectacular as he rarely managed to score winners or against big sides that season.
Besides, what about his 0 goal in the very same season in the CL? our full backs' assists were there in the league but not in the CL??? how can someone justify that?... that's one of the reasons I still think his biggest problem was this big club pressure thing, NOT our style of play. he delivered in the league but in the CL... he just couldn't cut it. this failure later came back to haunt him even in the league.
Here are Gila's goals from the 05/06 season, the final score and at what point in the game Gila's goals came. I'll highlight the goals that I think can be considered somewhat 'important'. What I consider to make a goal important, and it's reason:
-If your team wins by 1 or 2 the goal is important no matter when it is scored. Even if you win by 2-0, the 2nd goal is still very important as it kills the game, while 1-0 is still a very cautious scoreline late on in a game. Scoring the 3rd in a 3-0 win, however, isn't what I would consider important.
-Scoring in a defeat when you are losing by 2 or less. If you're losing by 1 it's important as your goal brings the game level, if you're losing by 2 you bring your team back into the game, so it's important at the time. Losing by 3 I don't think it's so important, you're still a way off.
-Scoring in a game that ends in a draw. Pretty obvious it's important, you've helped your team to a point.
@ Sampdoria - Lost 2-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Treviso - Won 2-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
@ Cagliari - Won 2-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Empoli - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-1
@ Empoli - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Udinese - Won 5-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
vs Udinese - Won 5-1 - Gila's goal made it 4-0
@ Fiorentina - Lost 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-1
vs Messina - Won 4-0 - Gila's goal made it 4-0
@ Livorno - Won 3-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Livorno - Won 3-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
vs Parma - Won 4-3 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Treviso - Won 5-0 - Gila's goal made it 3-0
@ Reggina - Won 4-1 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Cagliari - Won 1-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Udinese - Won 4-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
@ Messina - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 3-1
So in my opinion 14 of his 17 league goals could be considered 'important'. One thing people need to remember is AT THE TIME OF SCORING. Some people will probably argue the case that scoring in a 5-0 win - even if it's the 1st goal - isn't important, but it is. How is Gila meant to know his team is going to score another 4? So I base my stats at the time of scoring, obviously the outcome has a little bearing, like if the team was to win 4-3 and he scored to make it 4-0, it's still an important goal as it's essentially a game winner.
So 14 of 17 were important in my view, I think this somewhat dispells the myth that his goals are to just push up the scoreline.
-If your team wins by 1 or 2 the goal is important no matter when it is scored. Even if you win by 2-0, the 2nd goal is still very important as it kills the game, while 1-0 is still a very cautious scoreline late on in a game. Scoring the 3rd in a 3-0 win, however, isn't what I would consider important.
-Scoring in a defeat when you are losing by 2 or less. If you're losing by 1 it's important as your goal brings the game level, if you're losing by 2 you bring your team back into the game, so it's important at the time. Losing by 3 I don't think it's so important, you're still a way off.
-Scoring in a game that ends in a draw. Pretty obvious it's important, you've helped your team to a point.
@ Sampdoria - Lost 2-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Treviso - Won 2-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
@ Cagliari - Won 2-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Empoli - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-1
@ Empoli - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Udinese - Won 5-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
vs Udinese - Won 5-1 - Gila's goal made it 4-0
@ Fiorentina - Lost 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-1
vs Messina - Won 4-0 - Gila's goal made it 4-0
@ Livorno - Won 3-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Livorno - Won 3-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
vs Parma - Won 4-3 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Treviso - Won 5-0 - Gila's goal made it 3-0
@ Reggina - Won 4-1 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Cagliari - Won 1-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Udinese - Won 4-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
@ Messina - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 3-1
So in my opinion 14 of his 17 league goals could be considered 'important'. One thing people need to remember is AT THE TIME OF SCORING. Some people will probably argue the case that scoring in a 5-0 win - even if it's the 1st goal - isn't important, but it is. How is Gila meant to know his team is going to score another 4? So I base my stats at the time of scoring, obviously the outcome has a little bearing, like if the team was to win 4-3 and he scored to make it 4-0, it's still an important goal as it's essentially a game winner.
So 14 of 17 were important in my view, I think this somewhat dispells the myth that his goals are to just push up the scoreline.
Nice Post Kurt...
Where'd you find all the stats btw? (I can never find those sort of things 'when' I want to)
Where'd you find all the stats btw? (I can never find those sort of things 'when' I want to)
QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Sep 28 2008, 03:26 PM)
Here are Gila's goals from the 05/06 season, the final score and at what point in the game Gila's goals came. I'll highlight the goals that I think can be considered somewhat 'important'. What I consider to make a goal important, and it's reason:
-If your team wins by 1 or 2 the goal is important no matter when it is scored. Even if you win by 2-0, the 2nd goal is still very important as it kills the game, while 1-0 is still a very cautious scoreline late on in a game. Scoring the 3rd in a 3-0 win, however, isn't what I would consider important.
-Scoring in a defeat when you are losing by 2 or less. If you're losing by 1 it's important as your goal brings the game level, if you're losing by 2 you bring your team back into the game, so it's important at the time. Losing by 3 I don't think it's so important, you're still a way off.
-Scoring in a game that ends in a draw. Pretty obvious it's important, you've helped your team to a point.
@ Sampdoria - Lost 2-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Treviso - Won 2-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
@ Cagliari - Won 2-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Empoli - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-1
@ Empoli - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Udinese - Won 5-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
vs Udinese - Won 5-1 - Gila's goal made it 4-0
@ Fiorentina - Lost 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-1
vs Messina - Won 4-0 - Gila's goal made it 4-0
@ Livorno - Won 3-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Livorno - Won 3-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
vs Parma - Won 4-3 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Treviso - Won 5-0 - Gila's goal made it 3-0
@ Reggina - Won 4-1 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Cagliari - Won 1-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Udinese - Won 4-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
@ Messina - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 3-1
So in my opinion 14 of his 17 league goals could be considered 'important'. One thing people need to remember is AT THE TIME OF SCORING. Some people will probably argue the case that scoring in a 5-0 win - even if it's the 1st goal - isn't important, but it is. How is Gila meant to know his team is going to score another 4? So I base my stats at the time of scoring, obviously the outcome has a little bearing, like if the team was to win 4-3 and he scored to make it 4-0, it's still an important goal as it's essentially a game winner.
So 14 of 17 were important in my view, I think this somewhat dispells the myth that his goals are to just push up the scoreline.
-If your team wins by 1 or 2 the goal is important no matter when it is scored. Even if you win by 2-0, the 2nd goal is still very important as it kills the game, while 1-0 is still a very cautious scoreline late on in a game. Scoring the 3rd in a 3-0 win, however, isn't what I would consider important.
-Scoring in a defeat when you are losing by 2 or less. If you're losing by 1 it's important as your goal brings the game level, if you're losing by 2 you bring your team back into the game, so it's important at the time. Losing by 3 I don't think it's so important, you're still a way off.
-Scoring in a game that ends in a draw. Pretty obvious it's important, you've helped your team to a point.
@ Sampdoria - Lost 2-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Treviso - Won 2-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
@ Cagliari - Won 2-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Empoli - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-1
@ Empoli - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Udinese - Won 5-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
vs Udinese - Won 5-1 - Gila's goal made it 4-0
@ Fiorentina - Lost 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 1-1
vs Messina - Won 4-0 - Gila's goal made it 4-0
@ Livorno - Won 3-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Livorno - Won 3-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
vs Parma - Won 4-3 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Treviso - Won 5-0 - Gila's goal made it 3-0
@ Reggina - Won 4-1 - Gila's goal made it 2-1
vs Cagliari - Won 1-0 - Gila's goal made it 1-0
@ Udinese - Won 4-0 - Gila's goal made it 2-0
@ Messina - Won 3-1 - Gila's goal made it 3-1
So in my opinion 14 of his 17 league goals could be considered 'important'. One thing people need to remember is AT THE TIME OF SCORING. Some people will probably argue the case that scoring in a 5-0 win - even if it's the 1st goal - isn't important, but it is. How is Gila meant to know his team is going to score another 4? So I base my stats at the time of scoring, obviously the outcome has a little bearing, like if the team was to win 4-3 and he scored to make it 4-0, it's still an important goal as it's essentially a game winner.
So 14 of 17 were important in my view, I think this somewhat dispells the myth that his goals are to just push up the scoreline.
Thanks a lot, Kurt. it's certainly not as unimpressive as I thought. he did open the scoring/help expand it on many occasions. the only thing that still leaves me unimpressed is the teams he scored against. except for two or three, they are all small/average teams. no Inter, Juve, Roma, Lazio, etc.
And the other things is his CL record. but I say it again that his scoring record in the league, only in that season, is actually good.
QUOTE (TriniKing_CE @ Sep 28 2008, 03:14 PM)
Nice Post Kurt...
Where'd you find all the stats btw? (I can never find those sort of things 'when' I want to)
Where'd you find all the stats btw? (I can never find those sort of things 'when' I want to)
ESPN Soccernet is where I usually go for my stats, very good site for looking for stuff like that.
QUOTE (zdrossoneri @ Sep 28 2008, 03:17 PM)
Thanks a lot, Kurt. it's certainly not as unimpressive as I thought. he did open the scoring/help expand it on many occasions. the only thing that still leaves me unimpressed is the teams he scored against. except for two or three, they are all small/average teams. no Inter, Juve, Roma, Lazio, etc.
And the other things is his CL record. but I say it again that his scoring record in the league, only in that season, is actually good.
And the other things is his CL record. but I say it again that his scoring record in the league, only in that season, is actually good.
It's much better than I thought it'd be as well to be honest, but I agree that he doesn't tend to be a big game player, he doesn't score many against the top sides. Another thing is that when he scored we very rarely lost! Shame he didn't score more often.
QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Sep 28 2008, 10:28 AM)
ESPN Soccernet is where I usually go for my stats, very good site for looking for stuff like that.
QUOTE (zdrossoneri @ Sep 28 2008, 11:36 AM)
If Gila could only score headers on crosses then we did the right thing to sell him as he was not a complete striker. a complete striker is someone who can perform and score both with his head and with his feet! remember Sheva of old days?... I completely agree that our full backs failed to provide Gila with decent crosses in his last two seasons with us, but I for one won't accept this as an explanation for his goal drought because I still remember the great chances he missed...
+1
IIRC he was even chosen as man of the match. he really truly made CR his b1tch that night!
+1
IIRC he was even chosen as man of the match. he really truly made CR his b1tch that night!
ok well obviously scoring with ur feet is important too, and gila was always able score with his feet, well that is when he had confidence. take away his crosses, and you put him in an uncomfortable situation which in turn destroys his confidence. i mean come on look at pippo :rolleyes; the guy can only score tap ins yet none of us have a problem with him being a one-dimensional player, the furthest from a complete striker. what i had a problem with was how we fed him the ball most of the time, he'd always have his back to the def, and guys like seedorf, kaka would pass it to him and he'd be alone up front and he'd have to take on defenders which he is unable to do, also pippo or they'd be getting in each others way (btw pippo was beyond brutal during that period). and gila was never brought to replace sheva, it was for pippo and they are both from the same mold.
anyways i'm not saying it's everyone elses fault, yes gila has to take some of the blame. i just find it hypocritical for someone like gattuso who hasnt performed to criticize and demean him. and belive me he wouldnt be saying this if he wasnt in such good form, which is sorta sign of jealousy.
This all started when Gila, after scoring a goal or two for Fiorentina, said that Milan's style of play didn't suit him fine and that Fiorentina's was perfect, etc. etc. etc. Gattuso's comments were a respond to Gila's somehow critical words. he would have never blamed or criticized him without a reason. so let's not be harsh on Rino.
As for what I said about what a complete striker should be, I have to say I should have made my point clearer. what I meant was that a complete striker is not someone who can be relied only on aerial balls. many of those who defend Gila say the reason he scored 17 goals in his first season was because our full backs assisted him regularly and as soon as they stopped performing, Gila went through a goal drought. I say if he was a complete striker he would have had MANY MORE goals to his name now. I have the highlights of the last two seasons' games and I must say, Gila missed a lot of chances. I know he is not Pippo Inzaghi when it comes to abilities on the ball, but for some reasons, which I personally tend to think of them as psychological problems, he couldn't do well with his feet. most of his shots were awfully out of target and his tap-ins simply weren't good enough to beat the 'keepers. our full backs were to some extent responsible for his goal drought as they became somehow awful at crossing the ball. I give him that. but I can't find any answer for why he couldn't score some sitters with his feet, other than those 'heavy shirt' theories!
As for what I said about what a complete striker should be, I have to say I should have made my point clearer. what I meant was that a complete striker is not someone who can be relied only on aerial balls. many of those who defend Gila say the reason he scored 17 goals in his first season was because our full backs assisted him regularly and as soon as they stopped performing, Gila went through a goal drought. I say if he was a complete striker he would have had MANY MORE goals to his name now. I have the highlights of the last two seasons' games and I must say, Gila missed a lot of chances. I know he is not Pippo Inzaghi when it comes to abilities on the ball, but for some reasons, which I personally tend to think of them as psychological problems, he couldn't do well with his feet. most of his shots were awfully out of target and his tap-ins simply weren't good enough to beat the 'keepers. our full backs were to some extent responsible for his goal drought as they became somehow awful at crossing the ball. I give him that. but I can't find any answer for why he couldn't score some sitters with his feet, other than those 'heavy shirt' theories!
How was Gila critical? All he said was that Milan's system did not suit him, he did not say that it was wrong (and it was) and he did not say Milan should have changed the system just for him...
Then he said Fiorentina's system suits him better, he did not compare it with Milan's one.
Anyway... I think Gattuso should have avoided this especially since they'll get together for the Nazionale in the future.
Then he said Fiorentina's system suits him better, he did not compare it with Milan's one.
Anyway... I think Gattuso should have avoided this especially since they'll get together for the Nazionale in the future.
I didn't say he was critical. I said somehow critical you know, Gila can't only blame Milan for he missed too many chances that had nothing to do with the system of Milan!! he never ever said he missed some good chances in those two seasons, instead he just pointed finger at Milan's system and I think Gattuso was right to defend Milan.
you know, Gila can't only blame Milan for he missed too many chances that had nothing to do with the system of Milan!! he never ever said he missed some good chances in those two seasons, instead he just pointed finger at Milan's system and I think Gattuso was right to defend Milan.
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