http://www.firmiamo.it/berlusconivendiilmilan

Now I can't read Italian so if any Italian speakers out there care to translate please feel free. The only bit I understand is the vendi il Milan bit.

Seems the natives are getting restless.

So... What is that website?

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=ht...TF8&sl=it&tl=en

tells something more, maybe?

It's an online petition asking Berlusconi to sell Milan.

The petition seems to have been written by a rossoneri fan who
* is unhappy with the past couple of seasons
* doesn't like Galliani's recent statements about Italian clubs being unable to compete with Spanish and English clubs due to different tax laws
* doesn't like that Berlusconi is no longer willing to invest in the club
* thinks there's a conflict of interest between a PM-Berlusconi trying to fix the Italian economy and a Milan owner-Berlusconi investing heavily in the club

The petition also thanks Berlusconi for all he's done in the last 20 years, but thinks it's time for someone who is willing to invest in the transfer market to buy Milan.

Thanks Tennie

I must admit I can see where the fans are coming from, it seems season after season we are promised good signings but end up with excuses . I would like to see Leonardo take over from Galliani and be given a decent pot of money to spend - I think he would do a much better job

I also worry about Silvio's children taking over as it seems the one who has the say(Marina) is also the one with the least interest in the club. We need to see a little more ambition shown rather than false promises.

Look its cycle. The greatness is gone. Silvio is not dedicated to excellence with this club.

Look at Roman Abramovich. The guy came into London with a wad of cash and changed the game in England, thats why its so competitive now.

Its ridiculous how we settle for mediocrity. We get small acquisitions that seem underutilized and they end up getting injured or having problems down the road.

We stick to a formation and team that hasn't done anything in the past couple years. The Champions League was won but I can't say the overall team has done well. In scudetto we have been third. Last year I would vote us, weighted on the fact that we so many stars, the worst team in Serie A. We could not win a game at Home.

I'm for it, there's nothing worse than having an owner that doesn't care anymore. I'll even go as far as saying he's not a true Milan fan. It's all well and good saying you are, but just look at it this way. If any of us on here ownerd the club, would we lose interest? Not a chance.

I couldn't say no to Leonardo replacing Galliani. that guy has been a footballer himself and definitely knows this sport like the back of his hand (unlike Galliani ['Seedorf is a striker']) and he's qualified for this job IMHO. but Silvio selling the club? not a chance! I think his son would do a better job than him though, if he's got the money of course.

Ok Silvio .. Pull out ur money and leave the club right where you took it, deep in debt and filed for bankruptcy! Anyone who comes after you needs to show us how hard it was to make Milan what it is today!

It's not about Silvio imo. Galliani has been the one handling everything for god knows how long, and yes Silvio was president for these past 2 years before being re-elected, but still mostly it's Galliani that's been making the decisions.

And I think that they have been questionable at best and I sometimes question whether or not he understands that todays market is different to that of the 80s.

And even this transfer campaign, he got Flamini yes and that was a big coup but paying for players that we were so eager to get rid of just a season ago and claiming that they are new transfers does nothing to convince me that he hasn't lost it. I mean why gripe about money when you are willing to spend it on players that you sold just a few months ago for basically nothing?

And another thing, I don't believe his whole speach about how Italy cannot compete with England and Spain, especially not when you see Inter spending the ammounts they do. And we all know that Juve would be doing the same thing had it not been for the relegation

@R7, yes Silvio has brought Milan back to the top because of his ambition and investments, and I'm thankful for that just as much as anyone. But if an owner is not willing to continue being involved in his club especially in the monetary sense that changes need to be made. These days a club cannot survive on it's own and make purchases on the market good enough to compete with the other big clubs without someone that is willing to fund that.

i hate the transfer market

He made Milan what it is today with money, lots of people have money, sell to one of those. problem solved.

The difference between us, Inter & Juve is most of their money comes from one source - Pirelli, Moratti. Fiat. With us there are a lot of people involved in money making decisions not just Berlusconi & Galliani, so it's not as easy to just throw money here and there whenever you want.

yeah guys, there will be no consequences for their actions just because they own the club lol Go ahead and sell it to someone who will further invest into it. I already can see so many foreign investors ready to pounce.

I didn't say or mean anything like that, please don't twist my words.

han, I believe you are right !! I am not disagreeing with you. Silvio needs to bring in the $$$ and shove it in the face of Barcelona and get his boy .. It's easier as 1-2-3 for someone of his net worth!


But the problem is not with his ability to continue pumping in the cash, nor is it that he lost the ambition after being crowned #1 in the world. Silvio was a Milan fan, hard core, even before our parents were ever married. Milan was a double edged sword for him, on one side he gained the respect of the working class in Milan and on the other it gained him popularity in Italy as a whole by constantly being European Champion followed by crowned World Champion, and the Italian people started backing him. Berlusconi took this club from the drenches of relegation and bankruptcy, he brought it to life and made Milan what it is now (this is so easily said, but when you look at how other team's were managed during the past 20 years time, you will see that Milan stands tall, proud and a powerhouse unmatched in Europe and the World!).

You, me and the whole rossoneri family want the best for this club, as it has become a part of our lives, we are too attached. And as such we get frustrated when things don't go as smoothly as they did before .. But hey, the ride was never as smooth as we all expect it to be. This is a company under a very conservative owner. And as such, it should be affected by the political and economical situation of the country.

Not just Italy, the world as a whole is being affected economically. Even for us here (Kuwait), sure Oil is at $144/barrel today, but the inflation, and the rising prices of daily commodities is no joke !! The US has a recession looking it in the face, with the mortgage crisis (do you know that there are at least 150K families who lost their homes after filling for bankruptcy ?!) and a weak Dollar .. And I could go on and on with this, because it is a world catastrophe ..

Now look at Italy and Silvio taking over as Prime Minister ... I mean Romano Prodi’s resignation as Italy’s PM didn't come out of the blue .. To put it in a nutshell for you, Italy is in debt, and not any kind of debt but up to 107% of Gross Domestic Product (GDP) ... While Italy's capacity to pay that debt is at 5% GDP ...

But this debt wasn't new han, it was always there ... (As the IMF does a good job at taking you to such limits) ... The problem only worsened when the Euro was introduced, tax increased, and the production of Italy (a pillar of the Italian industry) slowed down ... Think of it like high tide and low tide on the beach; when high tide the water covers you and you feel safe and covered, but when low tide hits the water barely covers your knees and you stand there naked. This same could be applied to Italy from it's problems!

Now imagine the person responsible for bringing the Italian economy back to it's feet spending 30MM pounds left, right and center ...



p.s. You don't need to accept this, in fact you don't need to agree with me in whichever aspect I have discussed. Just keep in mind that Silvio is the PM now in a situation which Italy needs a kick start and the actions of his conglomerate will be chastised by the people of Italy. So if there is a player, a world class player coming, he will come but as discretely and as shadily as can be. Of course Galliani will say Milan wont pay 35MM on a player, such sums would be frowned upon by the majority of the tax payers in Italy. Hence even if Milan pays 60MM, it wont be disclosed to the public, and that is how I see it.

The issue I have with all this is around what you do when you can't afford top talent. I take a team like arsenal or juventus for that matter. The have an excellent youth system, keep there players. Usually 2-3 from the primavera are rated extremelly high and have a nice buy-out fee that makes both the team and the player valued alot.

I take Milan, we haven't had a top offensive youth player in years.. we finally get a di gennaro that has some potential and what do we do, sell him to get borriello which we owned in the first place. Is it that we had no money that we decided to sell 50% to genoa in the first place. If that was the case, why did we spend money on Ba... thats comical.

So for me the only issue I have with Milan is spend your money wisely if you don't have to throw out. If you look at all the players they have bought (excluding pato at this stage), we lost money on every one of them. this means we buy high and sell low. Usually that means we are buying just before the decline of the player. no good asset management in my account.

If we would have both Santacroce, cigarini, dosenna 2 years ago, we would have great assets today. both in players and sell value

er. We did earn a lot on Shevchenko.

As for youth players...the Zebras are taking a hiding right now in Italy for selling off Lanzafame and Criscito and selling half of Palladino and shipping him off to Genoa. The only young former Juve Primavera presumed to have a shot at starting for them next year is MAYBE Giovinco. They have only a couple of other former youth players in the squad (Marchisio and Belardi, the 2nd choice keeper).

Of the highly rated Milan primavera players, both Marzoratti and Pozzi have been sold and half of Di Gennaro has been sold (having seen di Gennaro play live, I agree that it was dumb to sell half his rights). However, the recent language is clear on them wanting to keep Abate in the long term (loan to toro with very high buyout clause) and Antonini is coming back. Paloschi is being promoted to the first team and so is Darmian. Milan have four primavera players in the U19 squad, the most of any team. There's been a lot of work over the last couple of years building up the primavera -- for example, bringing in Michelangelo Albertazzi from Bologna (he's one of the 4 in the U19 squad).

My biggest concern is of the ridiculous contracts we are offering players who are past their sell by dates. I mean we are stuck with paying dodo £4m a year - yet he's hasn't played since I can't remember. And when he does he's simply not good enough! Now we can moan all we like about how the EPL has the money and we don't etc, but when you start giving £4m a season over five years to players like dodo then you deserve all the flak you get - £20m wasted which could have bought us a couple of decent players

@R7 (not going to quate bucause that's waay too long )

You do raise valid points regarding the echonomy, Silvio's position as prime minister of Italy and how that will effect Milan. That's why Berlu resigned as president of Milan in the first place.

But why were there no transfers made of any great players (aside from Pato) in the last 2 years when Silvio was not Prime Minister. They had already been complaining about not spending that ammount of money before he got re-elected. So to me, your argument would have been valid had Galliani and Silvio not made comments about not spending too much money while he was not Prime Minister.

These past 2 years while Berlu was president we only had Pato come in, while making the sale of Sheva and other imprtant player even though they went for free (Stam, Rui).


EXACTLY!! Very well put. Fact is, especially this transfer campaign we haven't made wise decisions regarding how to spend money, in fact while constantly complaigning about it, we've made deals that in the end make us look like idiots because we have been losing money on them


Nodding along while reading this. Great post

Italy wasn't in debt in 2007 ... Italy has been struggling since the turn of the millennium. If you read into it, you will see what I mean.

Even with that said, I believe Milan will bring in players this transfer window .. But just as discretely as possible.

The past two years .. Well, lets just turn back the hand of time .. 1- calciopoli (and this was very serious at the time, that Milan didn't get news of it's entrance into the CL until it was almost August 1st) .. 2- Milan won the CL and no team that wins a CL breaks up ... Look in history, look at every CL winning team (except for the small ones like Porto).

Still, so far Milan is on the right track and has brought in 3 players ... And the window is still open, there could be two or three more coming in.

There is a reason behind letting Stam and Rui go, an ethical one and a one of moral gratitude to their service. Milan doesn't need the money, Fininvest is one of the richest holding companies in Europe.

What Galliani says in the media is exactly the politics that Silvio Berlusconi wants shown by Milan. Silvio wants Galliani to say such things, and say them loud and clear (not to Milan fans, but ..) so the whole of Italy will see that one of the richest men in the world, and their PM, is also affected by the crisis.

Now what Galliani can do in this market ? I believe he can do a lot as the ball is in his court, there will be more players coming in and this month will be the month where it all happens.

Exactly, you're saying it yourself that Italy has been in dept for a long time and in his previous tenure as prime minister Silvio didn't mid all that much spending the ammounts he did on players like Rui, Pippo, nesta and so on. So I don't get how you are basing your argument around the fact that Italy is in dept and Silvio is the prime minister, since this is not a new thing and in the past with the same surcumstance (dept, prime minister) Milan spent huge ammounts of money

Well, hopefully you're right, because I believe that Milan still need more then R10 or a striker, we need a keeper and I'm not even saying a Buffon or Casillas, just a keeper that I and other fans can trust to play, and not waite for his next screw up. And another center back would be ideal, but personally I can;t see it happening, we're already struggling to get a striker so I can't see how we can manage 2 other players

No one expected Milan to break up after the CL win, but people did expect Milan to re-enforce what was a squad that was in dire deen for some new fresh signings. We might have been successful in the CL but our league form was terrible and it pointed to another struggling season ahead of it if we didn't bring in anyone new, and that's what happened. After the CL win in 2003 we made some great signings but still managed to keep the backbone of the team intact, we should have done the same on 07 but we didn't, and now we're in the UEFA cup

I agree about letting Stam and Rui go and I fully respect how Milan handled it. It showed how classy we can be. What I didn't like is the fact that they weren't replaced by adequate players.

Again, I'm praying you are right about the 3 signings thing, but again, I can't see it happening.

He did become a figure of hate after that tenure. LaPalma is German, and he still hates Silvio the PM because of that record.

I wouldn't say that I hate the PM Silvio. It's just that I can't respect his behavior. He's exactly what Italy does NOT need. Besides that some things he says are...my oh my....

He did, but he did get re-elected soo....

Silvio's always been that way

bearing in mind Silvio had to form a coalition with the Italian version of the BNP says everythig to me..and Silvio had to resign as Milan President due to Italian laws of conflict of interests...as all the economy's of europe are suffering in a big way i agree with what has been said in previous posts that if Milan made big big money signings it would not look good on PM Silvio, saying that i believe there is a real bereft of truely world class players available and it's hard to compete with the cash ridden EPL for players.

p.s have to compliment members on some great post above!

My argument is that this time around, Italy is in far deep a debt and the mortgage crisis has hit them hard .. The best example and most easiest I could put for you is the high tide and low tide example ... As it is the reality of the situation in Italy. People are suffering and those people voted for Silvio (even those who loath him, from the south voted for him ..) they voted for him because he showed them a plan to get their economy back on track during his campaign and they are expecting something from him.


Maybe you haven't read much into it .. but these are some of the Italian problems:

- Italy has weak consumption growth, something which is necessary to make public finances sustainable.

- Italy's inflation rate (CPI) has doubled that which was in 2006 and 2007.

- Families are filing for bankruptcy, because they cant afford their homes anymore due to the banks raising the interest on them.

- Retail sales within Italy is showing weakness as it is on the decline.

- The business confidence index which is posted by the ISAE, is not showing promise either.


Bottom line is that Italy's growing weakness signs is showing everywhere.


It isn't black or white han ... It is much more complex than that. This is an industrial country, they depend on exporting and if the internal economy is ...


Italian Finance Minister Giulio Tremonti said on the 2nd of July : "Certainly this is the worst crisis since the war" (WWII) and he added "The effects aren't limited to the financial sector, they extend into peoples' lives."

Talks of a recession is not premature at this point han ... I follow these news witha very keen eye on the Eur (currency) and the Dollar on a daily basis and I know how hard Italy's economy is hit.


Now all this aside, Milan will still reinforce BUT I agree with the method to which Galliani is using and that is not to publicize what they are doing and how much they actually are willing to pay.

Exactly. Thing is I remember hearing that when Milan did well Silvio's popularity rose and vice versa, so a great Milan should make a great Silvio.

@Mishie, AFAIK Silvio's party is more of a right wing party so joining up with the Italian version of the BNP wouldn't be such a strange thing. Now had Prodi joined up with the same party...

And I think you have a point about there not being enough WC players around at the moment. as for the EPL having more money to spend, I can't see it going on for much longer as most clubs are seriously in debt. The bubble has to burst sooner or later

I know that Silvio's party is right wing but the coalition with a extreme right wing party is what i meant...as for your comment about the EPL and the bubble bursting i hope so! and so does Platini by the sounds of it with his quote about barring clubs fro the C.L who have excessive debts

very true

@R7 - It's not just Italy that is being hit hard, this is a worldwide situation which started in America(sub prime mortgage). Everyone in Europe is being affected in one way or another. Here in England our cost of living has shot right up(and don't even speak about fuel prices ), although I appreciate that Italy has always been a 'poor' country(nothing personal, just my view). Now I can see where you're coming from and normally I would say I agreed with you, but when I see Galliani give dodo a 5 year £4m a year contract then I have to disagree with you. That contract will cost Milan £20m!!!! Now I'm sure you and I could have spent that money far more wisely

Platini has had some excellent ideas, although they will never come to fruition unfortunately .

It does seem vulgar that in this current climate cubs are willing to spend ridiculous amounts of money on players and then pay them extortionate wages! It's worse when you consider the prices the fans have to pay for tickets.

^^^^ but that £20m is spread over 5 years as you said...and the reference about being a "poor" country probably only really applies to the south hence migration to the north for work..hence Juvebtus being the best supported club in Italy. It's a sad scenario now a days that money rules and not just in football in life in general so the gap between the have and have not's is becoming increasingly wider and that is more prelevant in football now a days..i've said this before on several occasions and sorry for boring you all with it again but Sky is to blame for this absurd amount of money in football...£3bn for a 5 year deal to broadcast the EPL is just crazy!

£20m is still £20m though!

As for Sky, as much as despise them they do offer a good if expensive service. Plus it is in their interest to hype the EPL up as they have a stake in it. There's no real competition to Sky unfortunately

True. Personally I'm not convined by the whole Italy can't keep up thing since basically all of the world is in this state. And it's not the fact that we don't spend the money it's the fact that it is spent un-wisely, keeping players for sentimental values that have high wages is ridiculous

And Silvio might have to worry about his image and what the people think of him as prime minister, but that it the reason he has resigned as president because of conflict of interest. So Milan making a good signing shouldn't be seen as such a terrible thing since technically Silvio is not involved.

But again, if this is all as you say R7, because of the whole Silvio being prime minister and him not wanting to spend millions on a player while the country is in such a terrible financial state, then why did Milan not make any great signings during these past 2 years before Silvio was re-elected?

I know about the subprime mortgage crisis and I am very aware of the situation in the middleeast with the staggering oil prices (if you want to know the reason behind all this, ask GW Bush ) and inflation. As I also know the situation with the EU.

What I am telling han is that there is a world catastrophe going on and Italy is hit real hard by it. They are the 2nd most in debt country in the world on a GDP basis.


About football, Silvio can afford to invest multimillions without even thinking twice, but his situation as the PM has made him take a stance on certain things. Like his conglomerate as a whole isn't making headlines with its acquisitions and what not .. So yes, Milan can afford to give 'dodo 12M/yr' ... And Milan can afford to bring in Ronaldinho and Eto'o at one go ... But the problem lies in the ethical and moral principles; and that is that Silvio has a responsibility towards Italy and its people ..


What I am trying to say is; Milan will reinforce with top class players, they just wont do it with the media coverage that teams like Madrid and Chelsea do ... It will be discrete and this is all I am saying!

Personally I'm still skeptical if that is the real reason, prime minister or not, he is still the owner, and he is the billionaire, what he does with his own money imo should not factor much since I don't think the Italians expect him to pay off Italy's dept from his own pocket. Yeah it might look bad on his part to spend a ridiculous ammount of momey on a player for his club, but again, it's his own money.

As for Milan actually making purchases, I'm still hoping they will happen, now if it happens descreately or the Chelsea way I don't care, if it happens I would be more then glad to tell you that you were right.

Again, I'm hoping you're right on this because Milan is in dire need of those world class players.

Because the problem started at the turn of the millennium .. The problem in Italy in particular if you ask me is from two areas; export and government spending ... Since the former is the pillar of the Italian economy and is showing grave signs of weakness and the latter is responsible for the 2nd largest debt ratio on the planet (this is not Abramovic's debt of 400MM or the Glazers of 300MM .. This is hardcore debt, placed on Italy by the IMF)!


Why and How come and any query you wish to raise will always be answered by your assumption han. I can never convince you and you (as anyone here) have already formed an opinion on it!


But I can tell you one thing ... That Milan needs to reshuffle it's ranks and that Milan will bring in players, as there are at least two coming in IMO!! But the question is, how will they come?! If you ask me, I would say that they will come from the back door, without too much publicity and without disclosing the actual amount of the transaction.

And hopefull you are right, I personally certainly wish that you are right and if this does happen then I would be more then happy to oblige and say that you were in the right.

And I see you side of things and you make valid points but again I'm still skeptical that this is the real reason why Milan are in this situation, and maybe who know, maybe it's only just part of the reason. Who knows, no one can tell for sure on here since no one knows what is actually going on behind the scenes, We're all just speculating here

Exactly ... So taking into consideration the circumstances of the country as of late, it is best to give the benefit of the doubt on something as critical as this ... Than to just mindlessly moan and complain without thinking about the circumstances that could lead to a countries downfall (literally speaking .. IF the US/Israel go into Iran oil will far exceed the expected @ $200/barrel, and Italy being an industrial country, it would just destroy their economy in one blow!).

It's not moaning and complaining, we're all different here, you might choose to stay more calm then others and choose to look at the bigger picture (really bigger picture in your case ) and others might choose to vent their frustrations about what is going on with the team they support. We're on a forum, it's why we're here after all.

Other then that, I might be frustrated sometimes and come on here to vent but other then that right now I'm patitantly waiting until the transfer window closes and see what happens then. But that doens't mean that I won't get frustrated at times it's just natural to feel that way

all views are welcomed here just as long as its kept civil (which you guys are doing )

Fair enough


It's just good to know what is going on sometimes .. The bigger picture gives you a better insight on what and why things are the way they are.


And believe me, I too am here everyday to see of the updates on the transfer window .. And it's like a count down has started, we are in July now .. its less than a month left

We try. Right R7?


Exactly. Hopefully we'll end it with atleast R10, I'm keeping my expectations low, so I won't be disappointed in the end. But hopefully you're right and we manage to get another player

Always

why do i get the feeling your taking the p*** out of me!!!!

We would never do that mish

you'd be the only 2 then!!