[milanbuf88]

It was not a decimated squad. We lost 3 players and half a Seedorf. The others were not really important as they weren't being played much. Yes the players he lost were important ones, but the squad he was given in the league his team plays in was still adequate enough to reach third.

As usual you drastically underestimate the losses over the summer. We lost arguably our four best performers in Ibra, Thiago, Nesta, and Van Bommel. On top of that we lost Cassano, Aquilani, and Seedorf who all had a large impact despite limited appearances. Everyone of those players would walk into our starting XI today. Your judgement has been clouded by your hatred.

[X-Offender]

Your judgement has been clouded by your hatred.

I don't think so. Han is simply stating that even with our losses, reaching 3rd place would have still been possible, and shouldn't be considered a miracle or anything of the sorts. If anything, Allegri is at fault for our disastrous first 3 months when he should have given his team an identity before season start.

[kurtsimonw]

It was not a decimated squad. We lost 3 players and half a Seedorf. The others were not really important as they weren't being played much. Yes the players he lost were important ones, but the squad he was given in the league his team plays in was still adequate enough to reach third.

As MB says, we lost over half of our first team and replaced them with downgrades.

You want it both ways though. One day you say the squad of last year was amazing and we should've won the title, then losing half that team you says should've have affected us much. Our team wasn't the best last season and this season, especially pre-Balo it was nowhere near good enough for top 3. A fight for 3rd was what I expected and that's what we got.

[dst]

I don't think so. Han is simply stating that even with our losses, reaching 3rd place would have still been possible, and shouldn't be considered a miracle or anything of the sorts. If anything, Allegri is at fault for our disastrous first 3 months when he should have given his team an identity before season start.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) Are you joking?

[X-Offender]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) Are you joking?

What's there to joke about? He was a handled a bunch of players, and he should have figured out how to play them efficiently before the season began. Instead, he went through countless combinations and experimentations before finally finding a formula that somehow barely managed to produce results.

[dst]

What's there to joke about? He was a handled a bunch of players, and he should have figured out how to play them efficiently before the season began. Instead, he went through countless combinations and experimentations before finally finding a formula that somehow barely managed to produce results.

That's just silly, I think the hatred on Allegri has reached a level where ridiculous things are being said. Show me a similar situation where a coach managed to do that and I'll show you a fairy tale.

[X-Offender]

That's just silly, I think the hatred on Allegri has reached a level where ridiculous things are being said. Show me a similar situation where a coach managed to do that and I'll show you a fairy tale.

I don't get what you're trying to say here. Silly? How's it silly? Ibra and Thiago were sold in July (or was it June?), so he had all the time in the world to re-organize his tactics and give another face to this team. He also knew that he would be getting a CB, a DM and a FW by the end of August. He should have realized that playing 4-3-1-2 without Ibra would have been difficult, but he still went with it and the results were disastrous. Then he went on changing formation and men in every single game. He tried 4-2-3-1, went back to 4-3-1-2 again, even tried 3-5-2 for a couple of games, and before he knew it, three months had passed and we were close to the relegation zone. You think this is acceptable for a coach, especially someone coaching AC Milan? He didn't have the excuse of injuries. Instead, he played frigging Acerbi over Zapata, when I was screaming my lungs out on this forum that the latter had to be a starter alongside Mexes. For many, many games our defense had different men in every game. It took him a long time to come up with this 4-3-3 formation, and for a handful of games we did have a good run. But even so, he always kept messing things around. Before it was Emanuelson as AM/RW, now we had to endure that idiot of Niang on the wing, and Bojan was completely ignored for the rest of the season. The other idiot Muntari was preferred to Nocerino. Boateng never exactly learned what his role in this team was. AM? CM? RW? After the first Barça game, our team completely lost it. These last few months have been a nightmare. Watching this team play became a chore. And everyone can say whatever they want, but had it not been for the refs, 3rd place wouldn't be ours now.

[kurtsimonw]

Implement a whole new system with a whole new squad without playing a competitive game... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[servbot]

It is a pretty good accomplishment to have grabbed 3rd given the circumstances of the squad this season. That doesn't mean that I would be sad to see Allegri go, though. I won't be upset if he came back either though. Like drucurl said, as far as what is fair, he kind of earned it, even if it was despite him instead of because of him.

Also really happy for Udinese for putting together such a strong finish. I've always liked them a little bit even though they don't win in European play.

[kurtsimonw]

but had it not been for the refs, 3rd place wouldn't be ours now.

You're right, it would've been ours last week had the refs did their job in the Fiorentina game. Ad I basically agree with what you've put Servbot.

This post has been edited by kurtsimonw: May 21 2013, 07:43 AM

[Zed.D]

It was not a decimated squad. We lost 3 players and half a Seedorf. The others were not really important as they weren't being played much. Yes the players he lost were important ones, but the squad he was given in the league his team plays in was still adequate enough to reach third.

3 players and half a Seedorf? nice try making it sound like it's no big deal, just "3 players" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) we're talking about Zlatan, Silva, Nesta here, those 3 are enough to make any team title contenders.

Yes, the squad was adequate enough to each third, and we did reach third! with a little help from the refs in some games, but all big team have that luxury. let's not complain about it.

I don't get what you're trying to say here. Silly? How's it silly? Ibra and Thiago were sold in July (or was it June?), so he had all the time in the world to re-organize his tactics and give another face to this team. He also knew that he would be getting a CB, a DM and a FW by the end of August....

You play too much FIFA. so does han. I refuse to believe it all is that simple. a great coach would've taken less time to do it than Allegri, sure, but BEFORE the season start?! as dst said you and han have taken this Allegri hate to a new, laughable and sometimes facepalm level.

This post has been edited by Zed.D: May 21 2013, 08:56 AM

[kurtsimonw]

You play too much FIFA. so does han. I refuse to believe it all is that simple. a great coach would've taken less time to do it than Allegri, sure, but BEFORE the season start?! as dst said you and han have taken this Allegri hate to a new, laughable and sometimes facepalm level.

It isn't that simple. If it was the league table would be the same every year. But some bigger name clubs fail often after a managerial change or a big squad overhaul, because it takes time. Even during a season it can take time - look at when Mancini wanted to go with a back 3, they really struggled because it takes time to get it right. But playing competitive games is the only way to get it done.

Expecting a coach with a new squad to just change a system for it to work in pre-season is like saying that we shoud've sent SES to go and play against the Primavera and in Serie C for lots of game time and he'll come back World class. Football just doesn't work that simply. Things have to progress in competitive game situations against good teams, otherwise they'll never be developed properly - whether it's a player or a system.

This post has been edited by kurtsimonw: May 21 2013, 09:31 AM

[Jack Sparrow]

I agree with the above two posts. I'm not a fan of Allegri-football in the slightest, but then sometimes he is held guilty rather irrationally and with a very myopic view of reality.

I do no buy the 'anything-but-this' attitude when it comes to football management. You can survive if you have enough depth in your pockets.

Right now, I think Allegri is eerily similar to the Dark Knight. He's the manager we deserve, though not the one we need right now. And we will continue to hunt him. He's a silent guardian. A watchful protector. A Dark Knight. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sleep.gif)


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WHAT THE FACK WENT INTO MY COFFEE? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

[acid911]

WHAT THE FACK WENT INTO MY COFFEE? :wack0:

Not sure I want to know. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

[han2503]

As usual you drastically underestimate the losses over the summer. We lost arguably our four best performers in Ibra, Thiago, Nesta, and Van Bommel. On top of that we lost Cassano, Aquilani, and Seedorf who all had a large impact despite limited appearances. Everyone of those players would walk into our starting XI today. Your judgement has been clouded by your hatred.

Cassano, Aquilani and Seedorf. Let's see what's wrong with all of those

Cassano. Heart problem, basically out for the entirety of last season
Aquilani, played some games at the start of the season, he was never really an integral player though, not like Monto for example. He got injured, we signed Muntari during the winter and Allegri didn't let him see the light of day again. He had 23 appearances, and a majority of them came from sub appearances. Yes pretty integral to the team (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)
Seedorf, another player who was mastly used as a utility guy to plug holes last season. Again, he was not an integral first 11 players for us

Thiago, Nesta and Ibra, yes were huge, so was VB, although his first half a season with us he was unplayable, last season he was so and so although he was still a regular. That being said, we replaced him with De Jong, who later got injured, but on paper we still replaced him with a very good player

And no my judgement has not been clouded by anything. I repeat. I judge based on the facts. I never said we should be able to win the league at any point during this season, because we do not have the best side in the league. Last season we were undisputedly the best side yet we still failed to win it anyway. That's the whole point here. I acknowledge that the quality of our squad took a hit this summer, a major one, because of those losses. But still with that fact, Juve in turn have the best squad in the league now, which is why I always expected them to win it.

My point has never been that we should be competing against Juve because we only lost 3 players of note. But that we should have still made third without needing referees to bail us out on a consistant basis because the quality of this league as a whole is just terrible right now and us losing the quality we did during the summer should not have meant that we went from title contenders to relegation battlers at one point during the season

I don't think so. Han is simply stating that even with our losses, reaching 3rd place would have still been possible, and shouldn't be considered a miracle or anything of the sorts. If anything, Allegri is at fault for our disastrous first 3 months when he should have given his team an identity before season start.

Exactly

As MB says, we lost over half of our first team and replaced them with downgrades.

You want it both ways though. One day you say the squad of last year was amazing and we should've won the title, then losing half that team you says should've have affected us much. Our team wasn't the best last season and this season, especially pre-Balo it was nowhere near good enough for top 3. A fight for 3rd was what I expected and that's what we got.

And I explained all of those

We later recovered by signing Monto, SES became a revelation at the start of the season, later signed Balo who is a top class player no matter his mental disposition, etc. Some were an improvement, some still felt like a kick in the teeth considering the quality of Ibra and Silva. But as I said a million times. you have to look at this squad in terms of it's competition as well. Serie A is as rubbish as you deem our squad, so our rubbish squad should still be able to compete and at least get into the 3rd position in this rubbish league without too much trouble.

And there you go, once again saying that Juve had the better squad than us last season, which is the biggest load of bull you've ever come up with. You point out all the quality we had last season and then in the same sentence still say that Juve's rubbish team of last season was better than ours. Just ridiculous!