[CHU-LIP]

...This is getting stupid,you're statement is without any proof.And why are disagreeing with me on something which even wasn't the major topic of my thread.I mean it's ok to say that Inzaghi is a replacement to Ibra.A striker for another striker,not that I was being precise about the matter...It's not illogical at all.

I just think it makes more sense Robinho should be preferred over Inzaghi as Zlatan's backup. Both Pato and Zlatan are strikers, both are profilic goalscorers (Pato the most). Robinho is a better player than current Inzaghi, and it doesn't matter whether he has to replace Pato or Zlatan, you will always keep a striker + Robinho.

[William405]

I think you got me wrong,I was talking that Robinho should be Pato's direct replacement but if Ibra is out then of course Robinho should replace one of them.I may have misphrased my sentence,doesn't matter any way.Not an important topic to talk bout.So Juve have injuries to both Amauri and Iaquinta so I've hurd.

[CHU-LIP]

I think you got me wrong,I was talking that Robinho should be Pato's direct replacement but if Ibra is out then of course Robinho should replace one of them.I may have misphrased my sentence,doesn't matter any way.Not an important topic to talk bout.So Juve have injuries to both Amauri and Iaquinta so I've hurd.

Oh okay, no it wasn't important. It was mostly the ''vice versa'' part that got my attention.

[shevchenko_007]

Some riveting arguments here lol... I love reading this forum but I don't post a lot.
I know we have to work with the personnel we have but this team should have transitioned to the next era of superstars already, but instead we are still using players that won the 2003 champions league. Although these players are/were awesome they should have begun to be replaced by younger talent by now.
People can bag Ronnie all they like but with the speed of movement and speed of play of the team at the moment I doubt that even Ronnie in his Barca form would be able to win World Player of the Year in this team.
We are too slow and too disjointed for large portions of the game and although players like Pirlo, Gattuso and Ambrosini may look like they are in form some of the time they lack what the team needs to compete with the powerhouse teams of today.
As for the Robinho vs. Ronnie debate, neither of them are attacking midfielders and to put either of them there is a waste, just like playing Pato out wide, or when Abate or Bonera play right back (or at all). A smart management team would have either bought Ibra OR Robinho (not both) and the other position should have been a proper AM.. If the retards did their homework they would have seen we could have got VDV or Joe Cole for free.
Anyway, those are just my thoughts.
As for the Juve game, I am loving that Krasic is not playing but I wish Iaquinta was playing coz he couldnt hit water if he fell out of a boat so I would have been more confident in our defence if he were playing.
I think we will win 3-1.

[acid911]

Finally a sensible post, shevchenko_007. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/king.gif) I have been reading both sides of the arguments, and for better or for worse, both parties are sticking to an extreme. Stats don't lie and neither do facts: Ronaldinho was our best player in terms of numbers last season, AND, he usually falters against big sides in must-win matches. Not just teams in the CL, but also in the last leg of the league earlier this year, when he said that we have to win these last 6 matches and treat them as knockout final. Guess, what we fared poorly in almost all of them, and Roma leapfrogged us.

All in all, I'd be inclined to call it an honorable draw, though personally I'm on Han's side - we can't discredit Ronaldinho completely, but again, he is the present, not the future, not someone we can build the club around for another 5 years. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) And you raised some very good points and, I agree with almost all of them. It's about time we broke the status quo - young players should have taken the reins two years from now, but we still have veterans starting those who played the 2003 final.

For my money, the reason we falter against big teams and in high-profile matches is that the midfield is completely sucked dry out from the game. X-Off calls it pace, Han calls it old legs of the midfield players, and that is the stone cold truth. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sleep.gif) I have been watching recorded old full matches, from 2009-10 season, and even this year, in all big matches, the team is scrapping for breath against the Reals, Manchesters, and inters.

And that is the reason why R80 falters, he just does not get the ball. A player like him will creating something out of nothing provided he gets adequate service. Same goes for strikers and forwards. A broken midfield puts constant pressure on the defense, and makes the attack as impotent as a room of eunuchs. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) The moments where we had a solid buildup attack (in big matches) can be counted on one hand. That's the reason for 0-4 (x2) and the recent 0-2. And like it or not, that's the reason for Ronaldinho's failings against big teams. He has to track back and get the ball, and pass the ball accurately (with opposing players on his tail).

Sure he has his flaws too, and he is no way near the player he once was, but still he is Top 10 material any given Sunday. The only time I would blame him is if he gets ample service and fails to make anything of it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) And there have been moments like this, hence the jury is still out on this!

[han2503]

Finally a sensible post, shevchenko_007. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/king.gif) I have been reading both sides of the arguments, and for better or for worse, both parties are sticking to an extreme. Stats don't lie and neither do facts: Ronaldinho was our best player in terms of numbers last season, AND, he usually falters against big sides in must-win matches. Not just teams in the CL, but also in the last leg of the league earlier this year, when he said that we have to win these last 6 matches and treat them as knockout final. Guess, what we fared poorly in almost all of them, and Roma leapfrogged us.

All in all, I'd be inclined to call it an honorable draw, though personally I'm on Han's side - we can't discredit Ronaldinho completely, but again, he is the present, not the future, not someone we can build the club around for another 5 years. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) And you raised some very good points and, I agree with almost all of them. It's about time we broke the status quo - young players should have taken the reins two years from now, but we still have veterans starting those who played the 2003 final.

For my money, the reason we falter against big teams and in high-profile matches is that the midfield is completely sucked dry out from the game. X-Off calls it pace, Han calls it old legs of the midfield players, and that is the stone cold truth. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sleep.gif) I have been watching recorded old full matches, from 2009-10 season, and even this year, in all big matches, the team is scrapping for breath against the Reals, Manchesters, and inters.

And that is the reason why R80 falters, he just does not get the ball. A player like him will creating something out of nothing provided he gets adequate service. Same goes for strikers and forwards. A broken midfield puts constant pressure on the defense, and makes the attack as impotent as a room of eunuchs. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) The moments where we had a solid buildup attack (in big matches) can be counted on one hand. That's the reason for 0-4 (x2) and the recent 0-2. And like it or not, that's the reason for Ronaldinho's failings against big teams. He has to track back and get the ball, and pass the ball accurately (with opposing players on his tail).

Sure he has his flaws too, and he is no way near the player he once was, but still he is Top 10 material any given Sunday. The only time I would blame him is if he gets ample service and fails to make anything of it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) And there have been moments like this, hence the jury is still out on this!

Exactly!! Especially the bolded part.

People are harping on about the match against Madrid. But what did we really see in that game? Our front 3 sucking big time, why? Because we couldn't get the ball past the half way line. So we were seeing Pato and Dinho practically trying to play in our own half, while Ibra was invisable for most of the night

[CHU-LIP]

And like it or not, that's the reason for Ronaldinho's failings against big teams. He has to track back and get the ball, and pass the ball accurately (with opposing players on his tail).

That is exactly what the attacking midfielder should do, and if he can't preform well then, he better not play.

[han2503]

That is exactly what the attacking midfielder should do, and if he can't preform well then, he better not play.

No! An attacking midfielder shouldn't be wasted trying to get back the ball because the 3 behind him can't do it.

[amancik]

No! An attacking midfielder shouldn't be wasted trying to get back the ball because the 3 behind him can't do it.

Agreed, when Kaka' was here, he didn't need to do a lot of tracking back. But then again, Kaka' was a Veyron. Him alone for counter-attack was enough.

[Fillipo Simone]

Hang me if you want, but I want to see a Pippo-Ibra pairing against Juve.

[shevchenko_007]

Hang me if you want, but I want to see a Pippo-Ibra pairing against Juve.

That's not a stupid I idea by any means.. it will never happen, but pippo can still produce the goods. He would have been helpful against Napoli as there were a couple of times where some good balls got played into the box and ibra was back at the half way line and pato was on the touchline. Pippo would bring a new dimension to our game IMO.

[X-Offender]

The guy's a freaking poacher, I fail to see what kind of new dimension he could bring.

[shevchenko_007]

When a ball gets played into the box and no one is there.... he will be there. He is always in good positions to receive a killer ball and is always making runs. He is an outlet someone like Ronnie could use very well.
Theres no point getting into it though coz he wont be getting too much playing time this season anyway, maybe only the Coppa Italia.

[Ry4n]

-----------Ronaldinho---------------Trequartista

----Pato---------------Inzaghi-----Strikers

imo the team should line up to a 4-3-1-2 formation like this

http://www.football-lineups.com/tactic/4-3-1-2

A great formation for teams with 3 hardworking midfielders and 1 outstanding playmaker (for example, Werder Bremen use Baumann/Frings/Borowski, and Diego as the playmaker). AC Milan have used a version of this formation, under Ancelotti, with Rui Costa or Kaka as the playmaker, and 3 midfielders more withdrawn (eg. Pirlo, Gattuso, Seedorf).

Or the 4-3-2-1 formation

http://www.football-lineups.com/tactic/4-3-2-1

An Ancelotti favourite!

He employed this at Milan with Kaka and Seedorf behind a main striker, either Pato or Inzaghi. It was very successful in Europe, where Milan reached two Champions League finals, and with attacking full backs can over power the opposition. He now employs at Chelse where they are virtually unstoppable in the EPL, with Maloude, Anelka as the attacking midfielders behind Drogba, and has revitalized Malouda with 7 goals this season already!!

A difficult formation to combat, as he plays with a back 4, two attacking full backs providing the width, which A.Cole is highly efficient at. A holding midfeilder sheilding the back 4 (Mikel, which is their only weakness) and two central midfielders in Lampard and Essien. The control pocession through the middle and create width with attacking full backs, and typically over run a standard 4-4-2 formation, hence Chelsea s success

This post has been edited by Ry4n: Oct 29 2010, 11:15 AM

[Jack Sparrow]

^^

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) Hee hee...laconic much?

------------Pippo---------------
--Pato-----------------Robinho-

IMO...Pato should be played on the slower wing of the opposition.