[han2503]

This is simply not fair. Seedorf is not a striker, and Paloschi has played 5 games in 15 days. He played in a U-19 Championship and the final. It's just not fair to Paloschi and he could have had an injury. I've read somewhere he was tired after all he has been through. While the game was imbalanced, I'll take that over risking injury to Paloschi.

You say Seedorf's not a striker, I say Seedorf's not a striker but that's what he's listed as on the official site and that's what Galliani says he is (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) What I meant is playing Seedorf in the spot he played these last 2 seasons behind the striker not as an out and out striker

And sure Paloschi would have been tired after playing so many games in such a short ammount of time but Carlo could have taken another primavera striker to the tournament, he knew the predicament the squad was in and should have prepared better.

On hindsight, yes ... But Carlo stated before the match that Palo didnt get any rest and was very tired.

Palo played with the NT and went directly to prepare with Milan for the Tim Trophy. And leaving out Seedorf might have been a precaution for something in particular.

han no one likes to loose, but at the end of the day there was nothing to gain from this match cuz it was a friendly.

Carlo takes the blame ? Why, because he doesn't know how to make omelettes (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

I didn't watch the match han ... I only saw the highlights yesterday after work .... To concede 3 goals in the opening minutes of the game, that is a matter to frown down upon.

But to start pointing fingers ... We already know that Carlo didn't have the players to complete the team, hence the team was bound to be 'unbalanced' .... you described the unbalancing as if it was Ambro's falt or Carlos .... The fault isn't there .. The fault is on the misfortune of Milan for having lost Inzaghi, Borriello, Kaka', and Nesta. And that Pato and Ronaldinho were not available. If you put these FIRST TEAM players back in the fold, I doubt Chelsea would have had an easy game, just as the scoreline suggested.

As I said to Giancarlo, yes it would have been too much to play Paloschi again in the match against Chelsea but Carlo knew how short we were in that area taking another Primavera striker would have been a smarter decision since he knew that Palo couldn't play the final match of the tournament because of fatigue

Ofcourse no one likes to lose, because as you said this is a friendly, frankly I would have been slightly disappointed had we lost 1-0 even 2-0 and not even think about it twice considering all the limitation Milan we had going into the game but to lose in such a manner, not only just the score line but to bow our haeds and give up within the first 6 minutes into the game was just un-acceptible. Yes at the end of the day it's still a friendly but it's an emberassment non-the-kess to get hammered the way we did.

Yes Carlo us partly to blame, he should have come into it better prepared (knew Palo couldn't play both games so why not take another primavera striker with him?) and his formation and games plan were bad decisions on his part. I'm not blaming Ambro, why would I? It would be highly unfair to criticise a player that is being played out of position. You could actually see how uncomfortable he was playing as a striker.

As for saying that this wouldn't have happened had those players you mentioned been playing, you can't be so certain, becuase only Nesta was missing in the defence and the mistakes that Kaladze made that resulted into goals would have still occured becase there is no way Nesta could have managed to cover those errors. As far as I can see our biggest problem is in defence, the attack I'm not worried about because we have a lot of great players missing but in defence we're all over the place and with Nesta and Maldini both injury prone we'll conceed cheap goals that will cost us important points in the league

This post has been edited by han2503: Aug 8 2008, 09:43 PM

[han2503]

DP

This post has been edited by han2503: Aug 8 2008, 09:39 PM

[acid911]

Okay, before I post my reply let me get this off of my chest. My last post was number 1337. God, I feel so leet. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif) Or for our non-hacker, non-video-game-nerd friends here: Elite.

Too bad the feeling didn't last as long as I would have liked.

[acid911]

there is no reason to get into the whole Kaladze debate, he showed again that he's mediocre at best but gor some ungodly reason he will still start games

Or as dst would say (if he/she was alive) unPaololike. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Come back dst, please. Ask Paolo to send you back to earth (or the little part of earth known as Milanfan). The forum has lost it's fun factor. Or is it that dst finally found a life? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) Goodness gracious, no! Heavens to bitsey, no!

Back on topic, though, there are various permutations of reasons what went into that match - some of which you mentioned above. The thing is that would very much make me doubt Carlo's man management abilities. Let's see here, playing Simic when the last time he played was an year ago, and by the same token the next time he plays will be next year. Okay Paloschi was worked up, but why not take that Ayumbyang fellow? Haven't seen that French chap for a while. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) You know with these French chaps. Even in some league matches he took a wrong team and lost, while better, faster players than say Brocchi were rotting on the bench. Anyhoo, had we some people called R80 and Pato in our ranks that day, things could very well have been the opposite. And we'd all be laughing along and having little chitchats about music, half-naked ladies, and Batman villains.

Plus as a side note it would also have given the team (and the fans) momentum powerful enough for the first four games before the merdas. Oh, how very much I hope we sneak in a dirty little win tonight, 2-1, maybe with a last minute penalty and spoil City's night? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) Na! They're the only sports related thing I like in Manchester. Not to mention they were the very few who smacked their United brethren a few times in the last few years. So let's hope for a good, fast, and entertaining match.

Thing is I honestly very much doubt the coach's technical abilities in the league, irrespective of what you guys may try to convince me otherwise. Here's another thing that I'll put in the doubts department. It's only a friendly, yes, but that's what friendlies are for, experimenting. With youth. Not playing mid 30s players as strikers. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) And getting hammered 5-0. Technically speaking 42-1 result is still a better result than this - at least you opened your scoring account and put up a fight. As great a coach Carl is, this little thing will be a bit of dark (ink)spot in his resume. Footballing or otherwise. And that puts Scolari a spot higher in my list of favorite coaches, not only becase the guy has a thinking brain, took Brazil to World Cup Glory, took Portugal also near to what they've ever been, and helped in relegating Kalac to the third spot. Come to think of it, he was probably higher up in the list even before, but who gives a funk.

And oh, agree about Chelsea fielding a decently strong side. What I probably meant was the this is not a team that Chelsea would have fielded if it was not a friendly, and they had all their options fit and available. I just shorthanded it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) A thing I learned from my pet Polar bear.

[Giancarlo]

You say Seedorf's not a striker, I say Seedorf's not a striker but that's what he's listed as on the official site and that's what Galliani says he is (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) What I meant is playing Seedorf in the spot he played these last 2 seasons behind the striker not as an out and out striker

And sure Paloschi would have been tired after playing so many games in such a short ammount of time but Carlo could have taken another primavera striker to the tournament, he knew the predicament the squad was in and should have prepared better.

Seedorf is an attacking midfielder. Attacking midfielders are including in the list of strikers. I knew that Carlo should have taken Aubameyang to the tournament, but who cares in the end? It was just a friendly. If anything this forced us back into consideration for the market. I'm fine with the result being a shocker, because it exposed gaping holes in our defense.

As I said to Giancarlo, yes it would have been too much to play Paloschi again in the match against Chelsea but Carlo knew how short we were in that area taking another Primavera striker would have been a smarter decision since he knew that Palo couldn't play the final match of the tournament because of fatigue

It was his decision, but I would have done the exact same tihng as Carlo did. It was not worth it.

Ofcourse no one likes to lose, but as you said this is a friendly, frankly I would have been slightly disappointed had we lost 1-0 even 2-0 and not even think about it twice considering all the limitation Milan we had going into the game but to lose in such a manner, not only just the score line but to bow our haeds and give up within the first 6 minutes into the game was just un-acceptible. Yes at the end of the day it's still a friendly but it's an emberassment non-the-kess to get hammered the way we did.

Get over it. It's past history. If I recall properly we lost a friendly in 2003 5-1... I don't remember to whom. And even worse.. in the Champions League we lost 4-0 to Deportivo, to lose 5-4 on the aggregate. That's more stinging than anything here with this dumb friendly.

As for saying that this wouldn't have happened had those players you mentioned been playing, you can't be so certain, becuase only Nesta was missing in the defence and the mistakes that Kaladze made that resulted into goals would have still occured becase there is no way Nesta could have managed to cover those errors. As far as I can see our biggest problem is in defence, the attack I'm not worried about because we have a lot of great players missing but in defence we're all over the place and with Nesta and Maldini both injury prone we'll conceed cheap goals that will cost us important points in the league

It's simply a friendly. There are some things we can learn from it... but, there is no reason to go on a bashing fest of Ancelotti for a STUPID friendly. And most of our experienced forwards were in some other part of the world, or just out on injury.

This is why I'm hoping the Ivanovic deal goes through.

[Giancarlo]

Unlike some around here, I accepted the result in stride and see that Milan is doing things differently... it's better we get a result like this, then have some draw. Besides that I attribute the bad result to primarily bad goalkeeping. I'm sure Abbiati would have muted the scoreline.

Accept the result and move on. There is no reason to cry about this.

[han2503]

Seedorf is an attacking midfielder. Attacking midfielders are including in the list of strikers. I knew that Carlo should have taken Aubameyang to the tournament, but who cares in the end? It was just a friendly. If anything this forced us back into consideration for the market. I'm fine with the result being a shocker, because it exposed gaping holes in our defense.

Seedorf isn't technically as attacking midfielder like Kaka or R10, he's more box-to-box and I prefered when he was played in a deeper role. The only reason Galliani started referring to him as a forward is because our only strikers where Gila, Pippo and Oliveira/Ronaldo and last season Pato who couldn't play until after January, so is order to make the front line seem more equipped he started referring to Kaka and Seedorf as forwards, and that's also when the official site started listing them as such. Galliani thinks that fans are stupid and would go along for this cr@p, like Ambro playing in defence, next thing you'll know he'' start calling him a defender and the official site listing him as a defender. Our defence has been terrible for these last 3 years, in 05/06, we still had Sheva, Gila had a good first season and Kaka scored a lot of goals that season in the league also, but our defence was still going bad, but since we had those players I mentioned all scoring a lot of goals we didn't take a big blow. But last season and the one before that where we had been struggling to score goals and we were conceeding tons of goals it effected us a lot having the defence we had. And even with all this happening in front of Galliani's eyes we still never bought a quality defender and they did not consider getting a defender after the Chelsea result either. The media just wanted to make it seem that way because they have nothing to say on Milan so the Chelsea result openened the door for new speculation regarding defenders, but it was never really considered by Galliani and he himself repeated this hundreds of times

It was his decision, but I would have done the exact same tihng as Carlo did. It was not worth it.

You yourself said that you would have taken Aubemayang in the paragrapgh befor this one. nd why wouldn't it be worth it? It's not like Carlo would be carrying the kid on his back! And not only would it have given Carlo better options upfront where we literally have no first team strikers but it would have provided Aubemayang with some playing time.

Get over it. It's past history. If I recall properly we lost a friendly in 2003 5-1... I don't remember to whom. And even worse.. in the Champions League we lost 4-0 to Deportivo, to lose 5-4 on the aggregate. That's more stinging than anything here with this dumb friendly.

Those are different things you are mentioning, those were the first signs of a team that could crumble which were then repeated in Istanbul. But this friendly is supposed to give us an indication of where the team is at before the start of the season and I'm not just mad because of the shameful result but EXTREMELY worried about the defence. Because Nesta or not, it won't be enough becuase all the others around him ar not up to standard and that worries me a lot, especially when I know that Carlo will continue to start Kaladze

It's simply a friendly. There are some things we can learn from it... but, there is no reason to go on a bashing fest of Ancelotti for a STUPID friendly. And most of our experienced forwards were in some other part of the world, or just out on injury.

Yes , it's a stupid friendly, but as I said, it clearly showed all our problems in defence when it comes to facing a top quality team, and we're just not up to standard

This is why I'm hoping the Ivanovic deal goes through.

Well you can keep hoping because Milan will not buy anyone else this summer, that I'm sure of.

[han2503]

Unlike some around here, I accepted the result in stride and see that Milan is doing things differently... it's better we get a result like this, then have some draw. Besides that I attribute the bad result to primarily bad goalkeeping. I'm sure Abbiati would have muted the scoreline.

Accept the result and move on. There is no reason to cry about this.

Did you see the match? Yea the goalkeeping was terrible but so was the defence.

And as i said to you in my previous post it's not only the result that concerns me but it's the defence that has raised the red flags in my head. And no matter what Carlo sayd, you can tell that he's also really wprried about this

[GrinReaper]

Did you see the match? Yea the goalkeeping was terrible but so was the defence.

Terrible doesn't even begin to describe it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

[acid911]

Well, there is one good thing about the match: The fact that it's now in the past. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[GrinReaper]

Well, there is one good thing about the match: The fact that it's now in the past. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

But I still have nightmares about Kalac's circusmonkey antics. I think I might have been scarred for life (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

[acid911]

You were not alone there. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sleep.gif)

Good thing it was a friendly, people won't remember this, what, 10 years down the road? And to think I had so much anticipation for the match, watching it with my Chelsea-fan-friends. Luckily, I got sick and had to drop out or it would have been just as bad as that Arsenal home match for the CL at San Siro. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) Sure had a long and lonely walk back home, then, in late winter.

There's something about foreign EPL fans (particularly in Asian countries), that no matter which team they're supporting they come together when they are pitted against teams from other leagues (Spanish, Dutch, German, and in particular Italian). No disrespect intended, but most of my Indian and Pakistani friends root for United/Chelsea/Arsenal/and Liverfools as if these teams are from their city. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) One win against Italian teams and they go bonkers quite easily forgetting they were defeated by the same team in their last three encounters. I guess it's not them, it's Barclays speaking.

[Giancarlo]

Seedorf isn't technically as attacking midfielder like Kaka or R10, he's more box-to-box and I prefered when he was played in a deeper role. The only reason Galliani started referring to him as a forward is because our only strikers where Gila, Pippo and Oliveira/Ronaldo and last season Pato who couldn't play until after January, so is order to make the front line seem more equipped he started referring to Kaka and Seedorf as forwards, and that's also when the official site started listing them as such. Galliani thinks that fans are stupid and would go along for this cr@p, like Ambro playing in defence, next thing you'll know he'' start calling him a defender and the official site listing him as a defender. Our defence has been terrible for these last 3 years, in 05/06, we still had Sheva, Gila had a good first season and Kaka scored a lot of goals that season in the league also, but our defence was still going bad, but since we had those players I mentioned all scoring a lot of goals we didn't take a big blow. But last season and the one before that where we had been struggling to score goals and we were conceeding tons of goals it effected us a lot having the defence we had. And even with all this happening in front of Galliani's eyes we still never bought a quality defender and they did not consider getting a defender after the Chelsea result either. The media just wanted to make it seem that way because they have nothing to say on Milan so the Chelsea result openened the door for new speculation regarding defenders, but it was never really considered by Galliani and he himself repeated this hundreds of times

Wow. This is not accurate at all. Clarence Seedorf started as a central midfielder, and was only pushed forward by Ancelotti. Since Ronaldinho is here, he will go back to being a central midfielder. He's not a forward. It's not about making the front line seem more equipped. It has nothing to do with that. In a 4-3-1-2 or 4-3-2-1 formation you don't need anymore than 4 strikers. Your ideas on Galliani are inaccurate. He is a shrewd person, when it comes down to it gets transfers done. When Inter failed to even get Frank Lampard, Galliani and Braida undertook a variety of transfer seasons. Our defense has only been questionable this last season. In terms of how many goals we conceded, it similar to the others. We didn't really concede a ton of goals last season if you think of it. We had many draws which did hurt us nonetheless. On top of that, it was the first half of the season that hurt us, not the second half. In fact from the top four, we had the best second half of the season. We have a rejuvenated midfield, and I'm confident a young defender will be signed.

We never bought a quality defender? The game against Chelsea was A STUPID FRIENDLY. I say get over it already and stop harping on about it. The formation was awkward. Nor was it expected that Kaka would be out again.

You yourself said that you would have taken Aubemayang in the paragrapgh befor this one. nd why wouldn't it be worth it? It's not like Carlo would be carrying the kid on his back! And not only would it have given Carlo better options upfront where we literally have no first team strikers but it would have provided Aubemayang with some playing time.

There was probably considerations not taking him. It wouldn't be worth it at all. There are other games to think about, and who cares about a Russian tournament that means absolutely nothing to us? Not only that the game was in Russia. Not like England or something. It's not as close as you think.

Those are different things you are mentioning, those were the first signs of a team that could crumble which were then repeated in Istanbul. But this friendly is supposed to give us an indication of where the team is at before the start of the season and I'm not just mad because of the shameful result but EXTREMELY worried about the defence. Because Nesta or not, it won't be enough becuase all the others around him ar not up to standard and that worries me a lot, especially when I know that Carlo will continue to start Kaladze

Frankly, I'm getting tired of this. You either should acknowledge I have different views than you, or I'm not going to continue this debate. People have seen how I treat people on goal.com and it's not nice. I've promised to be less abrasive on here.

This friendly is no indication because WE WERE MISSING A TON of our players. Two of our key players were not even in Europe. This friendly is no indication of anything. England starts its season weeks before we start ours, and started their training before ours (this is just obvious because we start later). I think some of your statements on Galliani and Ancelotti are shameful and wrong. I don't care what you're extremely worried about.

It is NO surprise to me that our defense did not do well, because they have not as much training as Chelsea did before this. Kaladze will do better when we get another defender. He, like Clarence Seedorf, steps up the game when there is competition.

Yes , it's a stupid friendly, but as I said, it clearly showed all our problems in defence when it comes to facing a top quality team, and we're just not up to standard

We played a stupid lop-sided formation. We're not up to standard? Says who? We faced two top quality teams in Italy with more of our players and we did just fine.

Sometimes flukes happen. Not only that the result was made bad because of bad goalkeeping.

Well you can keep hoping because Milan will not buy anyone else this summer, that I'm sure of.

You're dead wrong on that one.

Especially when Simic is being reportedly sold to Celtic. That'll leave us shorthanded by even one more defender.

Milan will not buy anyone else this summer? CARE TO PROVE THAT!?

Or is that just another baseless statement?

[Giancarlo]

Did you see the match? Yea the goalkeeping was terrible but so was the defence.

And as i said to you in my previous post it's not only the result that concerns me but it's the defence that has raised the red flags in my head. And no matter what Carlo sayd, you can tell that he's also really wprried about this

Yes I did, and I could not watch much more of it. A great goalkeeper would have prevented many of those goals.

You're simply not thinking. And I'm sick and tired of this. You can't even take into account most of our team was missing.

You said we will not be buying anyone else, but you can't prove it. Especially since the rumor is that Simic is going to be sold to Celtic. In that case we will have to get another defender.

[Tennie]

Most of the team was not missing for that game, Giancarlo - at least not the defenders. And they were embarrassingly bad, poor keeping notwithstanding. I'm with han on this one.

Just as there's no proof Milan won't be buying anyone new, there's no proof they WILL.

Please remember to cite your sources for rumors, such as the Simic one you refer to. Stuff like 'the rumor is' or 'I heard' should ideally cite a source.