[kurtsimonw]

Spain and England were the only unbeaten teams. Spain should've lost to Croatia. That means we are the real Champions. Spain may have the trophy, but we have a really obscure morale victory. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

[drucurl]

Spain and England were the only unbeaten teams. Spain should've lost to Croatia. That means we are the real Champions. Spain may have the trophy, but we have a really obscure morale victory. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

as always (IMG:style_emoticons/default/king.gif)

-edit- the "e" in "morale" has to go. It's the "moral victory" in this context

This post has been edited by drucurl: Jul 2 2012, 01:34 AM

[arivanjj]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/puke.gif)

this.

[Zed.D]

I firmly believe that this Spain team would have been totally dismantled by some of the former Germany, Italy and Brazil teams of the 70's, 80's and 90's. Heck even '02 Brazil looks a good contender.

But the fact that Spain could do this to another footballing heavyweight is a combination of many things:

1)Spain's determined and intelligent commitment to youth has paid off. And they appreciated ALL aspects of the game. They had the speedsters (Torres), the dribblers (Silva and Iniesta), the thinkers (Xavi) the allrounders (Fab and Busquets to an extent) and of course defenders and goal keepers

Too many times a country excels at creating one type of player and little in other positions or roles. Look at Argentina..they're always making someone who's a Maradonna lite...but in crucial positions like CB, GK, CM they generally come up short. Same goes for Portugal...zillions of CR7 clones and hardly anything else.

2) A SUPER COACH IN VDB. I cannot emphasize how great this man it. He won it all. And without the theatrics of Mourinho, Ferguson and the and other more media demanding personas in football. His low key apporach is often underestimated by many not the least the circus that is Real Madrid...but really there's no equal to TWO CL's a few La Liga's, a WORLD CUP and Consecutive European Championships

3) A system and an identity. Many nations have lost (or at least temporarily put aside their's in search of success). Spain endured a lot of humiliation in the 90's for always flattering to deceive but they stuck to their game plan and soon when the generation arrived that could execute it came along they were set.

4)Talent. Goes without saying but this point wouldn't exist if it weren't for the La Massia. Detractors will never run out of things to say but the project worked. Barca and Spain have proved this over and over again. Special mention goes out to Xavi - the REAL midifield maestro. Despite his less than perfect physique, he isn't the defensive liability that Pirlo is. Stays quiet and gets the job done. Some girly haired, overrated judas, ladri scum may seek to grab the headlines for the slightest of achievements but the REAL champions show up when it really matters. Some dare compare him with the guy that proudly wears the prison stripes but I wonder when Xavi gets too old for Barca will he huff and puff and join Real (Barca's most direct domestic rival)? Will he keep ill speaking them in the media? I guess time will tell (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

5) A TEAM. OH MY GOD THIS IS A TRUE TEAM 100% (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)
Look at the REASONS other teams/clubs have undergone difficulty and it's not only a matter of talent and tactics. It's the ubiquitous human element and the collective soul of the team. So many sacrifices. Look at Fabregas playing a false #9 all tournament. Do you think you could ever get Zlatan or anybody on the dutch team to cast aside their personal glory in their position for the unknown outcome of playing far far out of their position?? Torres rode the bench extensively and didn't even complain (much if he did at all)

David Silva an absolute genius for his club didn't get as much time as a player of his caliber might have deserved....yet ALL THESE GUYS CAST aside SELF in favour of the team and as many complaints as I DO have with the Spanish nt I truly appreciate this.

Top post. I totally agree with everything you said except the bold part.

Football has improved and evolved so much since the 70's and the 80's (more like tennis rather than boxing). I firmly believe the Spain of last night would've beaten any team from the 70's for fun. concepts like man marking and pressing as we know 'em today almost didn't exist back then. in fact football in 70's and before that looks kind of primitive compared to what I saw last night from Spain. not taking anything away from the greatness of those past superpowers, you can only be the best of your era and that's what they did. but the same has to be said about Spain. the reason I believe they're the strongest NT ever is simply because they have done what no other country has and that is their major tournament hat-trick. I don't know if a south American nation has done that, but Copa America can't be compared with Euros anyway.

Btw, Del Bosque hasn't won consecutive European Championships. it's his first (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

This post has been edited by Zed.D: Jul 2 2012, 09:11 AM

[kurtsimonw]

The teams back then probably didn't have a guy as the head of refereeing, discaplinary or being vice president of the governing body either - which apparently helps, who knew.

[Zed.D]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

They do the talking on the pitch and I trust my eyes more than what conspiracy theorists say. every team in this tournament got their share of refereeing mistakes, Spain were no exception.

[han2503]

Juve defense (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

Thanks for finally acknowledging how mediocre they all are. Balzaretti and Abate made a far better case for themselves. I don't get why Chiellini was started at LB in order to keep the weakest link in the lineup (Bonucci) and take out one of your best performing players of the tournament.

I have to say I was so disappointed by some of the performances last night, some of thsoe guys just did not come out to play, Pirlo, De Rossi, Barzagli, Marchisio, Balo, Cassano. I'd have expected a lot more they just strolled it. Pirlo did nothing yesterday but get himself into ridiculously dangerous situations in front of Buffon. Cesc and Iniesta pressed the hell out of him and DB showed him up big time, it's like I was watching Milan's Pirlo of his last few seasons with us

Prandelli has really disappointed me tonight. Some really atrocious decisions.

Totally agree, Chiellini at LB and leaving out Balzaretti was a huge gaff, but taking out Monto, who imo was the best player on the pitch for Italy to bring in a static guy like Motta was just stupid. I'm not going to blame him for the fact that Italy had to play with 10 because of this sub, because no one could have predicted that, but still, the intitial substitution was just ridiculous.

He should have brought Nocerino on to hassle their players off the ball for Marchisio or Cassano, pack that midfield up because Spain ran riot last night. The first game in the groups Italy played with humility and prandelli played a perfect tactical game, but last night was one huge brain fart on his part

[Zed.D]

I wasn't impressed with Balzaretti as much as you guys. sure, he was always going to do a better job at LB than an injured Chiellini, but he seemed capable of doing only the simple things right. he's one of those players I never really paid attention to in Serie A games, but if this was him having a good tournament then I'll pass. I'd have De Sciglio as our LB any day of the week.

[Fillipo Simone]

Based on one performance? Please.

[drucurl]

In other news Fernando Torres is possibly the most gigantic troll alive

1. Plays phenomenally for Liverpool and doesn't win $h!t
2. Earns a mega transfer to Chel$ki and is outscored by their new CB (Luiz)
3. Wins a CL in a penalty shootout with Messi, Ibra and CR7 all having bad luck at the spot
4. Plays utter Crap at WC 2010 and wins it
5. Almost doesn't play at Euro 2012 and wins the golden boot AND the whole thing!!

I'm pretty sure that he'll probably make an error in his lottery ticket and win the jackpot (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[William405]

Based on one performance? Please.

Exactly.

[X-Offender]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

They do the talking on the pitch and I trust my eyes more than what conspiracy theorists say. every team in this tournament got their share of refereeing mistakes, Spain were no exception.

Well, you know Kurt. EVERYTHING'S A CONSPIRACY!!!

[Zed.D]

Based on one performance? Please.

s
Talking about De Sciglio or Balzar?

OK, forget what I said about De Sciglio, my point was made about Balzaretti. he's 30, doesn't have room for improvement and is no Zambro. for once I'm OK with Zampa acting like a **** towards us.

I think De Sciglio showed more than enough promise, I'd be hugely disappointed if we didn't try to give him more time to fit into the team and become a regular.

[CHU-LIP]

s
Talking about De Sciglio or Balzar?

OK, forget what I said about De Sciglio, my point was made about Balzaretti. he's 30, doesn't have room for improvement and is no Zambro. for once I'm OK with Zampa acting like a **** towards us.

I think De Sciglio showed more than enough promise, I'd be hugely disappointed if we didn't try to give him more time to fit into the team and become a regular.

He does't have to. Balzaretti is a good left-back, actually played a good Euro2012 (semi-final he was excellent, match before good as well). He will be our best full-back. And what's the prob with Balzaretti as our starting left-back, Antonini our backup left-back, Abate our starting right-back, and De Sciglio as our backup right-back?

(Hoping De Sciglio will take Abate's place rather soon than later.)

This post has been edited by CHU-LIP: Jul 2 2012, 03:28 PM

[X-Offender]

We'd be lucky if we signed Balzaretti. I don't see it happening, though.