Even though Genoa plays good this season, we're clear favorites on paper. That said, with the right lineup and mindset, we could win this one.

What I want to see most next Sunday is a proper midfield selection, meaning; no Muntari, let Van Ginkel and Bona start again

Essien will be unavailable. If de Jong isn't fit enough, there's no chance of not seeing Muntari.

In that case at least he'll be in the DM position, meaning he won't have freedom to roam about as he usually does and make a general nuisance of himself

Only issue there is his God awful passing. He'll be the last man in front of the defence so if he makes one of his usual passes straight to an opposition player we'll be in deep sh!t

Diego Lopez; Bonera, Rami, Mexes, Armero; Van Ginkel; De Jong, Bonaventura; Honda, Menez, El Shaarawy

Finally, Danny might be able to witness his favorite midfield.

Every day a new formation. Every day.

It's the same formation as last game, genius. Only De Jong instead of Essien, which is very welcome.

Nah, I meant to say players. Personnel. Could care less about the formation, you either develop your own unique philosophy and stick to it through thick or thin. Or you keep making changes, depending on the opponents and maybe even your own form. Besides, Inzaghi is still learning.

I'm more concerned that we just always get new faces every week. Sure is the perfect recipe to wreck momentum and maybe even team spirit. Though in this case, there is some stability, Mexès, for example. Lopez. Menez, Shaarawy. But it's going to change again once Montolivo is back, Abate returns, or injury strikes.

And that will always affect our playing form and momentum. Just hope we settle on a first XI and stick to it.

And I meant personnel, too. It's the line-up that played against Udinese, only with De Jong instead of Essien, who's suspended nonetheless.

Finally, the midfield is perfect. Only took 4 months. Pity about the defence and attack mind you, but it's a start. And no Torres is a bonus.

Is Pippo FINALLY starting to lose his stubborness regarding team selection? All of Mexes, Armero, Van Ginkel and Bona starting suggests he may at long last be willing to look at new ideas rather than playing everyone out of formation and picking out of form favourites. Still unhappy at Zapata's absence and Bonera at RB but it's progress. Wouldn't Rami, Mexes, Zapata and Armero have been better?

Is Muntari available btw?

The only match this season I've not fully watched, but the midfield seemed a lot better than it has for months.

I agree on that, we all do. But it would be best to find our best XI first. Unfortunately that's where we all appear to disagree.

Nope, Muntari isn't available. That's why van Ginkel is getting a start, I think. Some suggest Montolivo might even start. Also, Armero's playing because both Abate and MDS are injured. So, it's not Pippo getting his act together, rather the injuries are forcing him to play these men.

I can dream. I will dream. And no one can stop me.

What are you talking about? Did you see last weeks game? It's the same lineup, personnel and formation-wise. Only de Jong is back.

We rotate because some players are out of form, injured or suspended. It's more or less normal, I really fail to see the point.


Why would Inzaghi "get his act together" concerning Armero anyway? You think he's better then MDS and Abate?

With MDS being crap, Armero should have been given a chance instead of being completely ignored.

Or used instead of Bonera at LB or Rami at RB & MDS LB.

MDS wasn't crap, especially not for the last few encounters. And anyway, I don't expect anything out of Armero.

MDS was crap. He was crap up literally until the past 3 or so matches.

Yeah I know you don't. You criticised him for doing what Bonera was doing, but made no mention of the latter doing it. Clearly you don't like Armero.

With regards to Van Ginkel, I totally agree with you x-off and Danny. But with regards to Armero I'd have to agree with Filippo, if MDS is fit then there is no reason for Armero to be playing. Armero is simply not a defender, at best he's a wing back, but he just doesn't really know how to defend, which will be problematic for us, especially if DS doesn't recover for the 2 big games we have coming after this one

For all of people's b!tching about Mattia, I personally see him as an exceptional defender but a poor attacker in terms of looking at a FB in more general terms. I personally think he'd be an excellent CB.

However, with regards to Armero, I then don't agree with how Pippo was shifting the entire defence around just so he wouldn't have to play him. If DS is fit, for me he starts, but if he's not fit then Armero simply has to be the guy replacing him, anyone else and it's pretty obvious what Pippo is doing

No, Bonera was doing concrete attacking work - with an end product. Armero just ran up and forgot about covering space. I don't trust him and the fact that he wasn't good enough for Napoli also plays a part in this distrust. But I'd be happy to be proven wrong

Yep, this! Although, I think X-off is referring to the games where MDS was totally crap, and a game or two on the bench would have not have done him any bad. But, yes I also don't think Armero is anything special..Pretty sure he only works with teams that play with 3 defenders and wingbacks.

That's what I meant? I didn't say Armero should start ahead of MDS, I was highlighting if he's not playing well then he should have competition for LB in the form of an LB and not Bonera or anyone who isn't called Armero.

Or if unfit Armero is a decent deputy.

However that all said MDS has been poor as LB for a long time, and his recent good displays were at RB. Which contradicts past history but remains true nonetheless. But while he was there, for Armero not to play at LB was something of a slap in the coupon.

Not according to everyone else.



Wasn't good enough for Napoli? He played a full season there...

And 63 caps for a very strong Colombian side suggests he's nowhere near as bad as you make out.

I do agree he's a wingback rather than a pure LB, but then, arguably Abate is too.

And who does "everyone else" constitute?

You're really ready to say that Bonera and Armero (against Udinese) played similarly?

This is my (final) assessment:

Bonera 7 - did a good job in the first half, especially with some crosses and passes. Second half he lost his breath but still looked solid.

Armero - 6 - did nothing spectacular but got out of position on some occasions. Luckily the Udinese attacks didn't constitute any problem.

And finally: Bonera is a bad player who played a solid or good match against Udinese. I try not to be biased as some here are and judge players by default. Armero had also a solid match, but my point would be - I don't trust him because I don't see it in him to be a classic leftback.


Armero started 9 times for Napoli last season and came in as a sub for another 5 matches. Another 3 times for West Ham. Pretty unspectacular.

Colombia? Very strong? Only this WC, apart from that, Colombia isn't a strong side at all.

The Columbia side from this past WC featured Armero-Yepes- Zapata- RB. I believe they played a back 4, and all three of those guys looked like studs, with Yepes as their captain and leading the team. Clearly it had something to do with the team or the coach because although Zapata is usually solid, he makes some serious match-costing mistakes, and Yepes although a calming presence, was also slow and prone to errors during his time here. There are plenty of players who get a boost from playing with their national teams, these players don't seem to have the same fire when they play for their clubs. I'm not saying Armero is one of these players because in the past he has shown promise with Udinese, but I don't think he is the industrious back and forth LB we need.

With that being said, I think Armero is a solid Wing Back, with poor defensive ability. What he provides in attack he costs the team defensively. Against Udinese he was pushing up really far, leaving a hole behind him, Udine couldn't capitalize because they only played with Di Natale in attack. With two strikers, one can drift down that channel and expose the CBs which, given our CB duo, is something we should look to avoid. DS seemed to be recovering in form
in the past few weeks after a lethargic start so I think he deserves to be the starter when healthy because he offers more cover at the back. Armero is a good LB who should sit when DS is healthy but should be available from the bench as a situational offensive option for Inzaghi.

Everyone else other than you.



So...you won't judge players by default, unless they're called Armero and you don't trust him...

And it's probably not the best idea to back up your argument by simply rehashing your own ratings.



37 appearances. For club and country. Including West Ham.



Pogba didn't start at all for Man Utd and Pique only started a few times for Everton. That defence doesn't wash.
And isn't even that relevant here.



So...apart from reaching the quarter finals of the world cup, they're rubbish?

And...seriously? Colombia aren't a strong side? 3rd ranking (admittedly not the best barometer I concede) in the world and they're not a strong side?

Do you read the words you type before hitting 'add reply'

Back 3 I recall. Think Armero was more advanced.



Kind of. Zapata looks a different prospect when paired with Alex or last season with Mexes. Struggles without a titan next to him, a leader type - he needs a foil to his own style, which is very direct and combustious, and exceptionally quick. Alex and Mexes lead better.



Don't disagree with that assessment, but he is still very capable.



My concern with MDS is his form at LB. For the past year it's been poor. He's also changed his mind twice about what side he prefers. He had recent displays at RB which were much better. But he struggles to identify which side is his best.

Agreed.



Who?


No. I just don't think Armero is good as a starting LB or should bench MDS. I don't rate MDS effort as low as you do, and I don't think bringing in Armero would give us any stability. As Maldini03 said, he's a good attacking option, but nothing more.


Okay. Sandro Sabatini gave Bonera 6.5 (called him effective and dangerous), Armero 6 (too shy, wasted opportunity); CalcioWeb has Bonera at 6 and Armero at 5.5; CanaleMilan Bonera 6.5 vs Armero 5; Forza Italia gives Bonera a 6 (competent) and Armero a 5 (careless); Goal.com has Bonera with 4/5 stars while Armero got 3/5.

But no. It's only me, huh?

Look, one game is just one game. Bonera will most probably make a grande horror show next time. Problem is, I don't share your enthusiasm towards Armero. I think MDS is and will be better, and if he's available, he should be played. Should Pippo play Armero as second string before Bonera? Most certainly.


Not impressive at all. As I said, very little games started, and WC + prep games help boost the number.


Both however were at the very early stage of their career. So it's a far fetched comparison.



No, not rubbish, but nothing special really. What makes them strong?

The entire match thread. You're the only one who called Armero for attacking too much but left Bonera off with it scot free.



Oh Lord above. Have you not read my argument on this? I don't disagree with this! I would rather have an on-form MDS at LB than Armero. But MDS has been in poor form for so long without anyone giving him competition. And even when he wasn't available Armero didn't take his natural slot at LB. Bonera did!



Could someone possibly help me here

I'm saying words but they don't appear to be registering.



My Lord. Again. At no point have I said Armero should be a first choice starter if everyone's fit. FFS!



Not the argument I made. My point was you called Armero on attacking too much but didn't call Bonera for doing the same thing.



*sigh* it's like talking to a brick wall at times, no offence Pippo.




So...games he started aren't counted as useful in judging how many games he started/appeared in?



For some reason I thought Pique was Everton. It was Man Utd. And given Pique, after having made so few appearances for Man Utd in 4 years went onto make 44 the following season with Spain/Barcelona. And Sir Alex admits Pogba was one of his big mistakes.



3rd in the world, quarter finalists of the world cup? I didn't say they're the best team on earth, I said they're strong. To refute that is absolutely ludicrous. The team Rodriguez, Martinez, Cuadrado and Ramos play for isn't anything special?

I think you're artificially dismissing them because it suits your argument to do so. They're a very strong team and few would oppose that stance. Oddly enough that few includes you!

Concrete attacking work? He made 3 decent crosses, none of which managed to hit the target, all of this was in the first half as he completely faded in the second

I repeat, Bonera has always been decent at RB, he usually carries out the role in a no fuss no muss manner. it's when you switch him to CB that he's truly diabolical

But personally speaking, I wouldn't want him anywhere near the starting 11 no matter what position, he's proven over and over that he not trustworthy, neither in terms of performance nor in terms of discipline. He'd be my last choice for any position on the pitch.


I clearly remember you saying you wanted Armero starting ahead of DS more than once so far this season, and I do understand why you'd say that, DS has been off colour this season, no matter where he's played (he only played one game at RB this season and imo was equally as poor as he has been so far this season on the left imo). However, with that being said, purely in a defensive capacity, I'd still go for him as my starting LB no matter what form he's in as he's simply a more reliable defender than Armero, who imo is very weak defensively. The game against Udine highlighted this perfectly, and it wasn't even a game where we were under pressure for any significant amount of time. And I've said this throughout about him.

So for me, if DS is fit, he simply has to play, if not then Armero in my mind should be the only choice of backup for that LB spot, any other "crafty" manoeuvres Pippo tries to employ are seriously grating and I'm totally with you on that one


Hmm, Abate over the years has proven to be a natural RB, and I was never impressed with him when he was played at LB for Italy tbh. Even when he lost his form this past season he was usually a reliable defender whereas his attacking work was mediocre

Oh Han not you too. I was wanting Armero because MDS was in bad form.

Are you lot doing this to deliberately infuriate me? It's working! *rage*

That's why I said:


I do understand where you were coming from when you wanted Armero to start over DS, because DS has been struggling this season.

However, my point was that no matter what form DS is in, I really wouldn't want Armero starting over him, for the simple reason that he's not a good defender.

That's my point basically, that while I do understand where you were coming from, I just don't agree with you on that bit

I don't think we are.

But by God is this hard. One more time: I completely disagree with your assessment; Bonera and Armero did not do the same thing. Bonera made his runs, finished them with concrete passes and crosses. Han and you probably agree that the crosses were too high, I think they were good, but the main point is all these ratings I posted above do not thing that Bonera and Armero played similarly, stress Bonera's effort and Armero's recklessness/carelessness.

But this is it, I don't wanna hijack this thread for a Armero talk.

Oh, and yes, I really don't think Colombia is anything special. Yes they're 3rd because of the WC. But other then that, in the recent few years they did nothing to be called specially strong. In fact, this is their first WC since 1998, right?

Let us all hold hands, sing kumbuyah and move on, shall we?

I don't like the song but by all means, let's move on.

Montolivo to play instead of MvG.

Source: Mediaset

Confirmed.

MvG and Monto are essentially exactly the same style so I'm not absolutely gutted at this change, although my sympathies lie with MvG who will never get a run in Pippo's team.

It's still the 3-prong midfield I've been canvassing for - a destroyer (De Jong), an 'all rounder' (Monto) and a more creative attack minded AM (Bona).

If we play well today, and I believe we will, certainly in midfield, that'll be the first-choice trio for the rest of the season, injuries and suspensions notwithstanding.

It's also the first 'real' time this season of starting with the same back 4, albeit the one previous time was derailed by Alex's injury v Palermo on 3 minutes. Unfortunately the back 4 is patchwork, with Bonera as RB and MDS still missing.

Lopez; Bonera, Rami, Mexes, Armero; De Jong, Montolivo, Bonaventura; SES, Menez, Honda.

In terms of attack it's the best we have. Good on paper but not less so on the pitch. In defence I'd have played Rami, Mexes, Zapata, Armero.

Menez and his no passing policy ticks me off to no end

Such a messy game, neither team can keep possession for any decent amount of time

Should have scored Menez!

FFS!!

!0 corners we've given them in this half

1-0

What a funny goal to concede. What was Armero doing, standing on the right for minutes? How is this even possible?

LOL

Bonera again!

What does this make it? The 7th or 8th crucial error that he's made this season that directly lead to us conceding?

What?

Armero seriously? You're going to blame him?

Bonera was the one supposed to be f@cking marking the scorer and he just crumbled to the floor

Lol, watching that replay from behind the goal makes Bonera look like an even bigger idiot if that were possible

Menez again with a great opportunity to play the ball through and ruining it by over-dribbling

At least that goal seems to have finally woken them up from the stupor they were in

What a terrible game! It perfectly shows the lack of quality in Serie A

rush, rush, rush, mistake. Rinse repeat from both teams.