I also think, the lack of a genuine physical threat upfront hurt us badly. Especially with teams who clam up, and park the bus. For instance against Reggina, we were putting in aerial balls and crosses, not all of them bad, but we had no one upfront, who could cope against the defenders physically to win it. We lack a monster upfront like Toni or Drogba. Borriello's absence has made us suck in that aspect.

So this is where I'll disagree slightly with you all. I don't think we lost points coz our defence was bad, but because our attack was stifled. Yesterday was one of the handful of matches where our defence lost us the game. Against the big teams, no matter how good your attack is, your defence has to hold up. While against the smaller teams Milan can safely have the score one goal more attitude.

We did in theory address the physical presence issue, with Borriello, but then his injury has completely derailed it.

Feel free to crucify me for saying this but Borriello is overrated. Massively, I may add. One good season does not a great player make. You're having trouble unlocking defenses, we should have brought back Ronaldo. Or bought someone else. I know he's a hard worker, and Milan youth players, but take a look at his goal scoring record - that too for an in-and-out strikers:

Milan 16 (1)
Triestina 9 (1)
Treviso 27 (10)
Empoli 12 (1)
Reggina 29 (2)
Sampdoria 11 (2)
Treviso 19 (5)
Geona 35 (19)
Milan 7 (1)

He is not an attacking midfielder like Gourcuff, nor a mix bag like Kaka, nor a forward like Pato or Sheva. He's a hitman, a deep lying goal scorcher, who's only job is to go out and net the goals. And frankly the results are there for all to see. Even in the 7 games he played now, scored 1 goal (with guys like R80, Kaka, Pirlo and Seedorf behind him), that's beyond pathetic. It was all revealed in a game where he messed up four or five clear chances. I must admit I bought into the hype pre-season, and the only reason why I'm not completely ruling him out is because he's injured (which is a funking sad state of affair in of itself, if you ask me), and while he's maybe added something to our game when he played, the guy never got a long run for himself. Yet.

But frankly a guy who loses confidence because his flame (girlfriend) leaves him, and his performances starts suffering is just meh. Just ask Inzaghi and how many intimate relationships he had? Never let your personal life affect your career, and vice versa. For me, he's been the flop of the season in Italian football, along with Quaresma.

Well, in our scudetto-winning season I remember us struggle and fight till the last minute. There were matches we won in extra time. But the diffrence was, we didn't conceed, we kept our goal locked. Nowdays that's hard.

But I agree. Borriello out and Shevchenko more then just unfit and off-form, we have a striker issue.
Can we hold on to Borriello is the question?

Hold it! Jack didn't say it's Borriello we need, he just said he is the only one who could make us profit from all these crosses and high balls. Of course Drogba would be better, but we had Borriello and I think it was more then just fair and reasonable to give him a shot!


I don't agree that he was beyond pathetic. From what I've seen, he was good, and with Beckham in our team now, he could be even better.


I don't know why you overreact that way! Gee, the guy played a few matches and then went injured!! How can he be a flop??

The thing is it was not so... obvious that we would concede some late goals by the minnows...

I got what Jack meant, of course. And no I'm not downgrading him or writing him off. Not until he gets a fair amount of games under his belt, and his performance is better analyzed. I just believe it was not right bringing him back, we could have sold him for close to 20 million, and then bought in two decent (but similar quality) players, or one great and proven one.

He was nearly a nobody before his Genoa run, loaned day in and day out to various clubs. It's there that he got into his stride, had ONE good season, and had his stock price raised. For me, at least up until the displays I've seen from him this season, he came across as overrated. Not crap or useless, but let's say just not Milan quality.


Well, Oli scored 3 goals in 26 matches for us while he was here, and he was labeled way beyond pathetic. We sent him on loan to Zaragoza where he got 18 in 37, and then he was made permanent there, next season 10 in 18 matches. He too is a striker like Bori, and his job is to slot in the balls in the back of the net. So was Gila. From what you've seen Bori was good. And I agree. But he didn't score goals for us like he did for Genoa (when we had a far better and world class midfield than them). Looking good doesn't cut it for forwards/strikers, let's measure all of them with the same yardstick, shall we?

7 matches is too small a sample rate, but then again his performances didn't awe inspire me, and maybe that's the reason I'm getting more skeptic by the day. And now that our season has virtually ended, he is still nowhere to be seen. And it's not like he's 36, a young guy like him should be able to hold himself up. Most other do.


Overreact? Not the right word. Neither is flop, per se. I just meant he had a really bad season, which I'm sure you'll agree with. Maybe he'll turn it around in the last 10 games, maybe he'll come back stronger, who knows? All I know is that we shouldn't jump to conclusions, both you and me. Or anyone else. In a game like football, a lot can happen in a small time frame, so nothing is concrete. Up till now what is concrete is that he utterly and epically failed this year (compared to the highs Bori had last season, and not necessarily because of his game, but also because he suffered from a really serious injury and had to pull himself up from it). Someone we brought back, put faith in to help us land the Scudetto, win us games, score goals: He didn't/couldn't do that.

Remember we also paid 10 million to sign him back. Luckily those didn't come out of your pockets, or mine. So for us, it's very easy to paint a picture we want. Neither does he sell shirts like Kaka, Paolo, Nesta, R80, R99, Seedorf, Sheva, even Pato. He's not an established player. Everything taken into consent, not good Boriello, not good.

And besides there was quite a hoopla over his girlfriend leaving him on national TV, and then he got so depressed that his performance and body-language started dropping. A lot of my friends and even media saw it, the last few matches. It didn't help that he got injured. As far as I'm concerned, frankly, I want him back, if even for the last 10 matches to see how he shapes up after injury, and what he brings to the table.

Case in point: Lecce second goal. Two points given away, when we should have expected all three!

Yes it was. every time we parked the bus in front of our goal after going up 1-0, I got this feeling that them minnows might score every moment. it was more than predictable.

Cap, have you even watched these games' goals?

Bologna. Genoa. Lecce. Torino. Juventus. Roma. Genoa again. Reggina. Inter.

We lost points in all of above named games because of awful defending. it amazes me that you say our attack is more of a problem than our defense. just amazes me to no end...

I agree, however, that we need a big guy up there. that's one story, to put the blame on lacking such a striker when in fact suckastic defending almost always ruined everything for us, is another.


EDIT: Statistically we have the second best attack in the league with 41 goals (Inter have 42 goals).
On the other hand, we have the worst defense among the top 4 teams with 25 goals (Inter have conceded only 17 goals)

Even statistics don't back up what you say.

Then you also read this...



Hence my point. Yup..we could have held on to a 1 goal lead if we had a super strong defence. But by that theory, you just need a super strong defence and an average offence, since you need just one goal. And vice versa too.

The advantage of having a big man is, you can lay back and defend your lead, while hoofing the ball up for the big guy. Which also means your opponents can't press you at will, without risking something or the other.It's a tactical thing, not directly translated into goals or whatever statistics.

I agree we have a bad defensive situation right now, but Zd the technicall term of what you are doing is - "**** facts".

Isn't every conceeded goal automatically a bad mistake by the defenders? Just like in 1996, 1992, 1991 or 2008. That way you can bold out all matches we conceeded, but that's not the point.

I'm not saying you are wrong, I just say these facts and stats lead us into a trap.

However, I don't think we lost the Inter match because of awfull defending. Fact is, we defended awfully, but that didn't directly result our loss. If Adriano scored that one-on-one, if Ambro didn't tackle Stankovic and the game ended 4-1 or 3-1 you may have said it was of because of awfull defending. You read my post in the match postscriptum. I said what I think costed us the derby - fullbacks, tactics and possesion.

Brilliant combo Capt'n.

Thing is - Milan, especially Ancelotti Milan, got used to the score-and-then-pull-back tactic. In every match we scored one and then one more, or maintained our offensive game-plan we won the whole package. But, in matches we scored and then locked up, things turned out bad mostly. Ancelotti should have changed or at least modified that? Maybe, but I wouldn't say it's just up to him anyway.

@ JACK

Again, I'm not saying we don't need a big guy! my problem was that you specifically said we lost points because of our attack, not defense. that's totally unacceptable. if our attack hasn't been spectacular, our defense has been dire.

@ FILLIPO

I don't think facts & stats are always useless. the standings are also based on stats? are they useless?!... we have reached a point where the number of our conceded goals is as bad as Siena's for god's sake!

So when is the Bremen game ?±

Give or take February 18, I reckon. Dida power!

Haha yeah

I did not mean during the match... I mean at the beginning of the season. You're saying it was obvious that we could not win... then can you explain to me why you got happy when we reached 1st place or why you got angry when Genoa equalized at the very last moment? After all it was obvious that we would lose more points than our rivals that's why we would lose, right?
What I'm saying is, you can't say it was obvious and right it off just like that. Milan would not enter the field if it was so damn obvious and the title would be given to Inter by fax (they've done it before). All of us could see that Inter were the favorites but Milan DID have a chance to win and we did not lack in quality cause the point gap is a result of us stumbling against the bottom-placed teams.

Every team has a chance, it's whether they have a realistc chance or not. In my opinion, only 1 team had a realistic chance of winning the title, and unless massive chances are made in the playing and none-playing staff at the club, it looks like there will only be 1 next season too, unless Juve also make changes.

Only in the last few games things could be very different. I don't think our chance was not realistic but anyway, this is subjective I guess.

I don't believe we need major changes either, but we do need a defense!

Saved me a whole lot of typing, Kurt. I wasn't too confident at the start of the season, because you know what, the usual suspects were still the same. And the way we funked up the CL spot after landing 4th, didn't help things. Neither did the friendly humiliations. What I mean to say is, there were signs of discomfort in the squad that were evident to the fans - to some less, to others more.

That's not to say I didn't believe. I wanted this team to win, and my eyes sparkled more than once this season, but deep down inside I always feared that whatever we put up, might not be enough. The players we loaned out, the players we signed, the amount we paid, the leaks (GK and CBs) we ignored, everything. I mean Carlo's job was far from secure and he knew it. But still.

Ten to watch in the UEFA Cup
Monday 16 February 2009e-mailPrintDiggSave

David Beckham (AC Milan)
With the likes of Pato, Ronaldinho, Kaká and Andrea Pirlo in the ranks Milan are the star attraction in the Round of 32, but the firmanent is shining even brighter since the addition of David Beckham. The 33-year-old, who is on loan from LA Galaxy, has surprised many with his impact in Serie A having left the European scene two years ago. A UEFA Champions League winner with Manchester United FC in 1998/99, he will be hoping to add the UEFA Cup to his long list of honours.

Danny (FC Zenit St. Petersburg)
Zenit have a ready-made replacement for Andrei Arshavin in their ranks with Russian record signing Danny looking to emulate his predecessor by leading the club to UEFA Cup glory. A €30m summer signing from FC Dynamo Moskva, he dazzled on his debut by scoring the winner against Manchester United in the UEFA Super Cup in August and, after settling quickly into the side, will be looking to hit the ground running in his first full campaign, starting on Wednesday against VfB Stuttgart.

Diogo Luis Santo (Olympiacos CFP)
After missing out on a place in the UEFA Champions League, Olympiacos are determined to make their mark on the UEFA Cup and with striker Diogo in brilliant form they could do just that. The Greek titleholders beat a host of top clubs to the 21-year-old Brazilian's signature last summer and his reputation has blossomed since. Strong in the air and with excellent technique, Diogo has taken Greek football by storm and impressed in Europe too, notably with a two-goal match-winning performance in a 5-1 rout of SL Benfica in the group stage.

Yoann Gourcuff (FC Girondins de Bordeaux)
Zinédine Zidane took Bordeaux all the way to the final in 1996 and they could go far again thanks to the sparkling form of playmaker Yoann Gourcuff. The 22-year-old has long drawn comparisons to the great Zizou and showed just why with a series of commanding performances during the UEFA Champions League group stage. With Milan set to recall Gourcuff from his loan spell at the end of the season, could he, like Zidane, be set for a final swansong?

Vágner Love (PFC CSKA Moskva)
Vágner Love scored in CSKA's UEFA Cup final win against Sporting Clube de Portugal four years ago and his competition-leading eight goals so far this term have got the club's fans dreaming of silverware again. The first leg against Aston Villa FC will be CSKA's first competitive game under new coach Zico, and with Love eager to force his way back into the Brazilian national side as well, the 24-year-old has plenty of reasons to impress.

Adrian Mutu (ACF Fiorentina)
Mutu scored six times in Fiorentina's run to the semi-finals last season and will be hoping to take his side one stage further this time around. Voted Romanian Player of the Year for the fourth time in December, the 30-year-old only found the net once in the Viola's UEFA Champions League group-stage campaign, but has brought the best out of prolific strike partner Alberto Gilardino.

Ivica Olić (Hamburger SV)
Olić may be on his way to FC Bayern München in the summer, but is intent on signing off on a high as HSV chase a UEFA Cup and Bundesliga double. The 29-year-old Croatian has had an outstanding campaign, with four goals in the UEFA Cup already, and his battling, tenacious style make him a firm favourite with the HSV faithful despite his imminent departure. "HSV is all that matters until the end of the season," Olić said. "I will give 100 per cent until the final whistle of the final game."

David Villa (Valencia CF)
The 27-year-old Spanish international needs no introduction – except in the UEFA Cup this season where he has been restricted to a single appearance as a substitute. With the competition now past the group stage, expect to see Villa unleashed sooner rather than later. With a return of 17 goals in 21 Liga games his inclusion would put Valencia right up among the favourites to reclaim the crown they won in 2004.

Axel Witsel (FC Standard de Liège)
It is no wonder some of Europe's biggest clubs are tracking Witsel, who was voted Belgian Player of the Year in January just a week after his 20th birthday. The dynamic, technically gifted attack-minded midfielder played in every minute as Standard's progressed from a tough Group C and his nonchalant style has fooled more than one opponent.

Ashley Young (Aston Villa FC)
Young was described as no less than a "genius" by his manager Martin O'Neill after scoring twice, including the 90th-minute winner, in victory against Everton FC in December. Even so, the 23-year-old winger is yet to fully deliver on his considerable promise – a frightening prospect for Europe's defences. If Villa are to progress the England international's pace, poise and passing will be key. His crossing sets him apart; only Cesc Fàbregas set up more goals in the Premier League last season.

uefa.com
©uefa.com 1998-2009. All rights reserved.

Are we now? Excellent share, though, Ken.

Dynamo Kyiv 1-1 Valencia
Zenit 2-1 Stuttgart
Olympiakos 1-3 St. Etienne
Villa 1-1 CSKA Moscow
Brememn 1-1 Milan
Bordaeux 0-0 Galatasary
NEC 0-3 Hamburg
PSG 2-0 Wolfsburg
Sampdoria 0-1 Metalist
Aalborg 3-0 Deportivo
Braga 3-0 Liege

Both disappointed and pleased by the Villa score. I didn't think we'd be good enough against CSKA given the players we're missing, so I'm pleased we avoided defeat against them. But on the performance, we should have won it, they only really hard one attack where a Villa defender slipped at Wagner ove scored, really against the run of play at the time. We pushed forward more in the 2nd half and hit the crossbar amongst other chances, Carew equalised with 20 to go and then it was about even for the last 15 minutes or so. We need to score in Russia and avoid defeat.. don't think we can do it.

Have a little faith Kurt

That's the spirit!

You know that it could be a blessing in disguise for Villa... if you go out of the competition this round, you can put all your energy on finishing amongst the top 4... I suspect you'd rather see Villa in the CL next season than further in the UEFA this season, probably drawing a strong team and going out in the last stages. right?

I don't really know much about the EPL and Villa, but when I look at the standings, I don't feel Villa's 7-point gap between with the fifth place is a fluke. and if it hasn't been a fluke, then Villa can continue in this path and beat either Arsenal or Chelsea to a CL spot. god knows I want that to happen! just as much as I'd like to see Genoa do that in Serie A.

My usual faith in Milan isn't that solid when it comes to this competition.

Ancelotti's Milan had trouble with small teams in the past, not only the domestic ones, also abroad. We also often underestimated a team, like in CL Deportivo, were we thought we have already qualified for next round. We have to be concentrated in both the first and second leg, and give 100%. Maybe Maldini ending with raising another trophy + the fact UEFA-C trophy is the only missing trophy for us will provide some extra motivation and concentration.

And the fact that this will be the last UEFA Cup in this format. Next year, it will be unveiled as the Europa League, and I sometimes think that maybe fate wanted us in this tournament to win it one last time! Who know. I sure as hell will be disappointed if we crash out of it, though.

SPurs lost 2-0 in the Ukraine to Donetsk.. another Gomes howler. He is really poor, shocking keeper. I think the "Flops of the Season" team would include 5 or 6 Spurs players!

And their stupid coach.

Stupid? Come on.. he's far more than that. I'll keep it to myself though, I don't want to be banned.

I think it's a pretty safe bet to say that we won't be going to Istanbul this May..

For those of you that don't really know our players, here's an indicator of just how weak the squad is.
Blue = Never started a Premier League game for us.
Claret = Not started a Premier League game this season.

We're going to get f'ing killed.

Goalkeepers: Brad Guzan, Stuart Taylor, Elliot Parish.
Defenders: Luke Young, Curtis Davies, Zat Knight, Nicky Shorey, Eric Lichaj, Ciaran Clark, Shane Lowry.
Midfielders: Steve Sidwell, Mustapha Salifou, Craig Gardner, Isaiah Osbourne, Barry Bannan, Marc Albrighton.
Strikers: John Carew, Marlon Harewod, Nathan Delfouneso.


Notable absentees: Brad Friedel, Martin Laursen, Carlos Cuellar, James Milner, Ashley Young, Stiliyan Petrov, Nigel Reo-Coker, Emile Heskey & Gabby Agbonlahor.

Where is everybody? They're all injured?

Is it just me or does it seems a bit like O'neill is trying to get out the UEFA Cup so he can focus on the league?

^^^

...and boom goes the dynamite!

Some are injured, some just ot called up. To make things worse, Carew got injured pre-game, so yet another first-teamer out.


Pretty much. Getting into the top 4 is far more valuable than doing well in the UEFA Cup.

FT CSKA 2-0 Villa.
-Harsh score-line really. They had alot of chances, but most of them were just long range shots that went nowhere near the goal, we had a couple of decent opportunities and should have scored. Their 2nd goal came in the 93rd minute when we were attacking the game.

Very pleased with the performances, Delfouneso, Bannan and Albrighton, the 3 up top for us, had combined ages of about 55.

You can always do both... like Fiorentina did last season.

They didn't win the UEFA Cup. So had they got to the final and rested players in the league, they could have ended up with neither. If I were given the choice I'd say top 4. In saying that, I think we'll lose in the qualifiers anyway.

Not because they did not try to... I'm not saying you'd win it but it does not mean that staying in until the semis and going out after 120 minutes and penalties would not necessarily rule you out of a top 4 finish...

I think they did, they played pretty much their best team in the game against Rangers and went out.

Anyways, not really disappointed, MONs done the right think in putting 100% focus on the top 4. If we finish 5th or lower, it won't be for the lack of effort.

Anyone's watching the UEFA-Cup tonight? Bremen vs. St. Etienne should be an interesting games as well as Hamburg vs. Gala.

OLIC IS NOT PLAYING for Hamburg. Fishdoll is sad.

Here's the fixtures..

CSKA - Shakhtar
Dynamo Kyiv - Metalist
Hamburg - Galatasary
PSG - Braga
Bremen - St. Etienne
Man City Aalborg
Marseilles - Ajax
Udinese - Zenit

CSKA and Dynamo currently lead 1-0, Hamburg-Galatasary is 1-1, the others haven't kicked-off.

Gala were lucky in the end not co concede another one. Olic and Trochowski missed two great chances.

Well, the lone Italian team left in European competition left it late, but they did actually win.

Udinese 2 - 0 Zenit. Goals by Quagliarella in the 85th and Di Natale in added time.

Well done Udinese!

Bravo Udinese,alone in Europe!

ps:11 yellow cards and 1 red card

Well-done to Udinese but.. I never thought I'd witness the day when, of all the teams, Udinese are the only representatives of Italy in two major European competitions, as early as mid-March. it was a season to forget...

My money is on City. CSKA and Ajax are probably the biggest 2 names that remain in the competition and I saw them both play at Villa Park this season, neither were overly impressive. Though I'd like either of them 2 to win it and I really hope City don't at the moment!

Marseille, PSG and St.Ettienne in game and you say CSKA is with Ajax the biggest name? What's up, you don't recognize the French?

PSG aren't a big club in my opinion, not at all. St. Ettiene are very under-rated, but haven't won anything for a while. Marseilles are also a big club, I just think they're edged out by CSKA in, especially how well they do in European competition, while Marseille never seem to acheive anything.

I don't rate the French league highly at all either.