Crap defender. What happened to his Parma days ?

Italian trio watch Bonera

Please go.

Roma would be the ideal destination for him.

Roma would be the ideal destination for him.

Roma would be too good for him. he's a Genoa-level player.

I don't think any of us saw a run like this coming from Bonera.

He has been, frankly, outstanding recently - one of our best players and definitely the best V Inter. I didn't see him coming back to this effect, but honestly he's better now than he's ever been - his positional sense has vastly improved, his timing is better, he's SO much better in the air than he used to be, and he even shows composure and class on the ball now.

And skill...

I didn't see this coming, but as long as he keeps this level up, Mexes has his work cut out to get back in.

Maybe he's simply improved with age. Who knows.

I believe the lack of quality makes him shine like that

So you think all of Mexes, Zapata and Silvestre are inferior players?

Bonera has been doing recently what I suppose we all hoped when we signed him. He was a decent enough Serie A defender that was signed to fill in if a starter needed a rest/injury and to do a job. That's exactly what he's been doing.

I think he meant overall. But yes, all of them lack the true qualities of an all round Italian defender. Bonera used to be Italy's big hope, and he had the luck to play along Billy, Sandro and Paolo. So he did learn a few tricks here and there. That's what makes him now so different.

Agree with both Kurt and Simone.

Tbh..I don't give a damn right now about potential and capability and class. Under Allegri that just doesn't seem to have mattered.

What I care about is form. And going by that, Bonera is quite possibly our best player right now.

Opinions change so fast, in the space of three months, Bonera moved from then player 'some' wrote on a list for out-going players, today he is being considered as our best.

The ruler is straight like that

Let's wait until he has one of his horror shows and he'll be back on the out-going list so fast for people it will make your head spin

For me Bonera is still the same player he was just a month ago and just last season. He's a good rotation player to have in case of injuries but you simply cannot rely on him as a starter because you will get burned sooner rather than later, yes he's currently on form but I'm usually just waiting for that mistake to happen during a game which is why I don't really trust him

If only you could see Monto in the same light

Indeed.

When does Monto make mistakes that cost us games?

Because, in my humble opinion, he isn't the same Bonera he was 3 months ago.

He used to be clumsy, he used to have little positional sense, he lacked composure on the ball, and he made errors.

Nowadays he is none of these things. He's a different player, and he's done it now consistently for the past 6 games. If it had been one match, sure I'd have ignored it as a blip. 2 matches, borderline same. 3 matches...hmmm....4 matches...this guy is showing real form and consistency. 6 matches down the line and he's actually getting better.

Like Jack (and myself) says, it's about form. And he's on a hot streak which makes him first-choice for the foreseeable future. Either that is a temporary bizarre spike of form, or he's not the same player. Given it's 6 impressive displays, I opt for the latter.

It'll be a Rami/Bonera central defence January onwards imo.

No he hasn't, he's been our best player. We didn't expect that when we signed him from Parma. And he hasn't been anything like our best player in the years we've had him.

Suddenly, right now, he's surpassed even De Jong as our most consistent impressive player.

We signed him as a squad player. All he's ever been. Till the past 6 matches where he's clearly taken Mexes' slot - initially out of necessity, but now out of sheer form. And deservedly so.

Then you don't know Bonera that good.

First of all, I don't believe a player can change over the course of 3 months. Certainly not an 32 year old veteran.

But the thing is, this display he's showing isn't out of character at all. He's been good for us in the past as well, his problem always was consistency: his good run eventually got stopped by an injury or a horror performance. And he really had a few of those as well.

What's different now? Firstly, he has less competition. Secondly, he's been played as CB and not as an LB or RB. And thirdly, ever since Nesta left we've been lacking that type of Italian allround defender. Now Bonera is not even near to Sandro, but in a world of Barzagli's and Zapata's, he's a rare breed.

So I'm giving him the benefit of a doubt. I'll watch him closely, praise or criticize when necessary. But we shouldn't jump the conclusions and say he's a new man now.

Well, defenders or strikers usually do that, while Montolivo has a better position. But the point is, Montolivo is terribly inconsistent, just like Bonera. In fact, I'm really starting to like this parallel. Apart from Bonera's injuries, both are much alike. Big talents as youngsters that never materialized fully.

Cannot disagree with you more.

Bonera has shown us these same kinds of performances before, maybe even more frequently back then before he suffered various long term injuries.

I remember 06/07, he had an amazing run of performances, some really eye catching performances. And usually he has a handful of good ones each season. But then comes that one game, that one game when everyone rues the day they said anything good about him

I'm too lazy to search this forum, but it's filled with 100s of posts of evidence of how people blow hot and cold when it comes to Bonera.

Like Fillipo said, you don't suddenly wake up one day and become great, you either are or you aren't and Bonera simply isn't. He's good, and can be dependable, but nothing more

I think he's the opposite of inconsistent actually. Last season he was consistently good, while this season he's been consistently average with a couple of good games sprinkled in. That has to do with form imo, not inconsistency.

Bonera is just unpredictable.

Great post. Have nothing to add.

You are downplaying Monto's bad form. He has had more horrendous games this season than I can remember. Not just 'average'.

Form? If you play a overall horrible season it's not just about form. He's lucky this isn't the old Milan and we have tools like Muntari and Niang who fill the yellow pages; his Ajax debacle was on this track.

Average? I'd say he's been bad to horrible with a few exemptions.

Overall he's had one solid or good season; before that he was average at Fiorentina for more then a season, and now he's bad with us. I'd say he's pretty much inconsistent.

Him being bad with Fiorentina had more to do with the fact that he wanted out and they wouldn't let him leave.

He's had 1 great season with us and now this one. Had he not been given the captain's armband it would have been judged as an average season so far. But that captain's armband just raises people's expectations to a degree that even if he was having a good season, Monto would still be judged as unworthy of it, simply because of the symbolism it has, so now that he's not performing to the standard he set for himself last season it's projecting even worse.

The Ajax game is the only instance where he cost us in all the games he's played, I don't remember any other incident where you can attribute lost points directly to him, and yes you do have a point that strikers and defenders are more in the "limelight" in these types of instances, but midfielders can still cost you games, ask Muntari and Nocerino

I respectfully disagree.



So did Maldini, what's your point? And no, I'm not saying he's as good as Paolo, I'm just pointing out that you can label the injury/inconsistency criticism at absolutely every single defender in the world. Best defender is arguably Kompany right now - yet he had an average season last year.

I don't feel you can aim that criticism at Bonera more than anyone else.



I don't remember Bonera producing defending of this quality and I've watched him since we signed him.



He doesn't remotely resemble the Bonera of old IMO. And the Bonera of old rarely to never won MOTM awards.

I feel he's upped his game. And I stick by that. I'm sure he'll have poor displays now and again, he's human. But I can't remember him being this solid in the air before, or being able to read the game as well.

Is it not possible that he's maturing with age - maturing as a defender. Remember he played less than 15 times last season so it's not like he's been a total regular that we've been watching like a hawk in recent seasons. Mexes and Zapata owned defence last season. This year the backline has been a mess, including Mexes, and until recently Zapata.

I just think you guys are being harsh on him.

PS his last consistent run for us before his injury when he played 6 matches or more in a row (near enough) was tail end of last year. He wasn't half as good then as he has been recently.

Maybe 3 months was too short a timescale to refer to, but I just don't recall him being as impressive as this in the distant past.

Perhaps I am being wrecked this season by the travesties that are Mexes, Zaps (till recently), and Silvestre at the back and my standards have maybe dropped, maybe; but Bonera has been far better than them all in the past 6 matches bar Zaps V Roma where it was a close thing.

So, guys, who do you lot think will be our CB pairing next month with Rami's arrival then?

You consider his last season with us as great? I'd say it was average to good, but certainly not great.

@Danny: I agree wholeheartedly with han and Fillipo. The truth is, Bonera has had sparks like this in the past as well. You don't remember them, but I do. In 06/07, for example, he played some of his best games with us alongside Maldini.

As for your last question, for me Mexes and Rami should be by default our starting pairing in the back, but knowing Allegri he'll pull some crap like he usually does.

I just think that when it comes to Montolivo your objectivity tunes down a bit. Don't know why, but that's my feeling.

You say he had a great season? Well, you know my answer, but I won't get into it, because it'll look as a semantic contest now. We simply disagree when it comes to judging Montolivo's performances.


I'm okay with that, it's normal.


Bonera isn't comparable with Maldini on any level. Maldini was a complete defender; he had some downs - like every defender. But world class defenders like Costacurta, Maldini, Baresi and Nesta all were awfully consistent. Even on a bad day, they'd still do some good and only rarely got embarrassed by their opposition. Bonera on the other hand had only a handful of great performances, followed by many horror shows and some average showings as well. He never had one consistently good season for Milan: injuries, form and roster quality prevented this.


Han mentioned the United game. He had some more as I recall.


Yes, I can agree that he might matured a bit. And the point that he didn't play much in the last couple of seasons makes us hard to tell on his progress either. Here we agree.



We'll see. Knowing Allegri, he'll make a mess out of it.

Well I don't think it's important to pass judgement on what is a positive development. At Newcastle, I'm finding it hard to believe that Williamson has actually benched Yanga-Mbiwa but there you go.

And Newcastle are right now 6th and we just destroyed a team 5-1 not to mention beating Man U and Chelsea. Is Williamson the cause for this better composure at the back and all that?

Maybe.

It's the same with Bonera. Perhaps the current composition of the team and the strategy suits his gameplay more. Centre Backs are never the same the world over and their job description often varies. And the strategy always varies. Nesta was a brilliant stopper/man marker with great ball control. Silva was a ball playing defender with accurate positioning. Fortunately it clicked, and we started this tendency of playing the ball out from the back with Silva being our deep lying playmaker before Pirlo. And Nesta being more of a sweeper behind.


Bonera now plays that role more. He is good with those balls at his feet, always has been, biggest surprise like Danny said is his reading of the game has gone up leaps and bounds. It could be his age. He is perhaps a lot more relaxed and calm on the game. Could be anything. I don't give a shite what it is. My ego is not the least bit hurt to see Daniele being the best CB on this team or him keeping Mexes on the bench. I don't care. Mexes can be greater than Silva and Kompany combined as an individual, but I'll take the man who is delivering for 6 games on a trot.

I see no point in 'planning to fail'. Carry an umbrella with you, if you're going to walk around with it open coz you think it might rain you're being silly.

I guess I get defensive about it because I feel that people are judging him harshly and most of that is based on the fact that he was GIVEN (NOT REQUESTED) the captaincy and people are bitter about that.

And people on here went on and on about how great and important he was for us last season, even YOU (who was especially against him at the beginning) acknowledged how important he was for us and that his performances were unexpected for you.

But now because of that captaincy some people are even viewing last season through a different pair of glasses.

I agree, he's not captain material, certainly not at a club like Milan, and I also agree that this season, aside from a small handful of games he's been below par, and this is magnified by the fact that he's captain. But I think he's also judged very harshly by some simply for the reason that he's wearing that armband


I remember in 06/07 there was one particular game where he literally cleared it off the line Nesta-style. This was during that run me, you and x-off are talking about next to Paolo. He was undoubtedly MoM then

And Danny, you're making a point about him not being picked as MoM then as opposed to him being voted MoM for 2 games now. Well back then we had a roster full of star players, now we have this squad. Kind of easier don't you think?

Can't agree Jack, one of the biggest reasons I don't like Bonera next to Zapata is because they're both cr@p at playing it out of the back. Mexes has a better passing percentage than our midfielders, when Bonera and ESPECIALLY Zapata try to come out with it from the back or try something fancy we usually end up on the back foot.

I think that any good CB pairing needs at least one defender to not only be that but a great all round footballer, Mexes is definitely that, Bonera and Zapata simply aren't. Rami, from what I've seen is also great with the ball at his feet

What's normal, me being respectful towards you or disagreeing with you? Because the former is, but the latter seems a bit harsh. I don't just disagree with you (or anyone else) for the sake of it.

I have nothing more to add to this.

Signed for Villareal.

A bit surprised. Capri and Chievo mentioned, but Villareal that's...very unpredictable. I wish him the best.

He isn't that bad of a player, thats why. Had a whole bunch of horrific lapses in concentration and errors in defensive judgments, but there was a time when he seemed like he had potential. Heck, dst once thought fairly highly of him. That's when he played alongside Maldini and Nesta.

Sadly that was to be his peak, one feels. Wish him best of luck, nevertheless, was never a bad guy to begin with, not a troublemaker or a fire starter, the likes of which we have been treated to recently.

His flaw was positional sense. It wasn't the best.

His strength was willing to put his body where it hurt, and strength in the air.