[Danny]

He's not going to West Ham.

[X-Offender]

Wouldn't quite call it a step down. He's sitting 10th in the Bundesliga and going to a CL challenging, bigger club, in the Premier League? It seems certain managers just seem to get far more leeway than others. What Klopp has done this season is really awful, he should've been sacked.

Zorc is the success behind Dortmund IMO, he's signed these great players and Klopp has gained the benefits. As soon as he doesn't have these World class players, he had them in the bottom half of the table, despite having a top 3 squad.

One bad season and suddenly he's not good enough? Come on, now.

[kurtsimonw]

There's a difference between bad season and not even being in the top half (relegation for most of it). IMO the success is mostly down to someone else. In 7 years, he's had more than 1 bad season.

He's not as good as someone like Rafa Benitez, certainly less successful in every way. Would you give Rafa a very top job? No. Liverpool is about his level.

[han2503]

There's a difference between bad season and not even being in the top half (relegation for most of it). IMO the success is mostly down to someone else. In 7 years, he's had more than 1 bad season.

He's not as good as someone like Rafa Benitez, certainly less successful in every way. Would you give Rafa a very top job? No. Liverpool is about his level.

So basically you're saying he's Allegri (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

He does well as long as his team is stacked to the rafters with talent but fails once he loses some of his best players...

[kurtsimonw]

I don't know, Allegri finished 3rd with a team that hasn't even been able to dream of 3rd since.

As for Allegri, how many times did Conte reach the CL SF, Cup Final whilst winning the league? Conte must really be awful then!

This post has been edited by kurtsimonw: Apr 23 2015, 12:21 PM

[han2503]

I don't know, Allegri finished 3rd with a team that hasn't even been able to dream of 3rd since.

As for Allegri, how many times did Conte reach the CL SF, Cup Final whilst winning the league? Conte must really be awful then!

Like I just said in the other thread, Conte managed to win the league when he did not have the best team in the league, that honour was with Allegri who lost the league to Conte.

As for CL. Allegri is coming up against the first real hurdle in the next round, a hurdle that he won't surpass, simple as that. Going one step further than Conte doesn't make much difference ultimately, he'll still get KO'd by a better team

And yeah, Allegri did finish 3rd, in a league that had already crumbled down to nothing, thanks to some serious heroics, luck and awful penalties given to us. Let's not brag about that season because it was plain embarrassing more than a badge of honour. We were just as bad as the season that followed it (performance wise, luck just helped us through). Relying on the ref in the last game of the season against Siena was the lowest of lows

[kurtsimonw]

As for CL. Allegri is coming up against the first real hurdle in the next round, a hurdle that he won't surpass, simple as that. Going one step further than Conte doesn't make much difference ultimately, he'll still get KO'd by a better team

Conte couldn't get through a group with Galatasary and Copenhagen. Going one step further is one step further. It's better. Certainly a huge improvement of not getting over the first, very easy, hurdle that Conte failed to do last season.

[han2503]

Conte couldn't get through a group with Galatasary and Copenhagen. Going one step further is one step further. It's better. Certainly a huge improvement of not getting over the first, very easy, hurdle that Conte failed to do last season.

Yeah, Conte failed last season in the CL no doubt, I was talking about when he got them to the quarters, because that's the bar Allegri had to meet in terms of Conte imo. He really couldn't do anything domestically that wasn't already being done with ease by Conte.

But ultimately. One season doesn't matter for me. Conte is by far the better coach and tactician. Failing in one season of the CL doesn't change that for me

We'll se what Juve do against Real in the upcoming games

Going by Allegri's MO they'll defend for their lives and try to hit on the counter, we've seen this exact same scenario play out for us enough times now

[Fillipo Simone]

He knows how to win UCL. I give him that. But the man just isn't a league coach. In his entire managerial career spanning 20 years he's got three league titles. That does not justify his reputation at all.

In terms of continental/international trophies, yes, 8 is impressive, very impressive.

Bull.

You know how many titles won Arrigo Sacchi? One league title! Liedholm has 2 league titles (Roma and Milan). Ancelotti won league titles in England, Italy and France. I don't know many coaches who made that happen.

Sure, like Kurt said, he sometimes could have done more. But that's really unimportant in the big picture.

Wouldn't quite call it a step down. He's sitting 10th in the Bundesliga and going to a CL challenging, bigger club, in the Premier League? It seems certain managers just seem to get far more leeway than others. What Klopp has done this season is really awful, he should've been sacked.

Zorc is the success behind Dortmund IMO, he's signed these great players and Klopp has gained the benefits. As soon as he doesn't have these World class players, he had them in the bottom half of the table, despite having a top 3 squad.

I think you're being quite unfair. To overemphasize Zorc or Klopp is really not necessary. Both did a good job with little. Klopp managed to lift up the club from poor results and implement a system that didn't exactly thrive on world class players, at least not from day one. He knew how to handle and work with solid to good players like Kagawa, Lucas Barrios, Kehl, Subotić and a few others.

They also share the blame for this year's fall. It was again Zorc who signed big time failures like Ramos or Immobile.

[X-Offender]

And Sokratis, Aubumeyang, Mkhitaryan, Kampl etc. But yeah, let's blame Klopp.