[acid911]

But he didn't. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) Sure the strategy was in place, but it wasn't implemented correctly due to a couple of reasons, resulting in players being wasted in their roles. Particularly Tevez. Sure, the biggest letdowns were the players (as you put it) and then the stupid early goal completely disrupted things.

However, the fact remains that this Barcelona team is a notch below the one that Mourinho defeated in 2010. For the first time in a few years I've managed to see them across a full season, and they have their weak points, few and far between as they are. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sleep.gif) The goal that Juventus scored laid the weaknesses bare.

And besides, I expected Allegri to play a different game after 1-1, but he actually played into the hands of his opponents instead of solidifying and putting them on the back foot. Juventus tried to be brave in the final quarter of the match and paid the price.

The scoreline may show 3-1, but it was a very closely contest match (up until around the 90 mark with the score at 2-1), and for this both Juventus and Allegri deserve credit. But for me, personally, that special something was missing from the Italians. A perfect match they did not play.

[han2503]

I can't agree. Going with 4 CMs was definitely the right thing to do.

If not for a poor refereeing decision not to give the penalty, which became even more highlighted when Pogba was fouled again, seconds later, to allow Barca to break, it could very be a Juve victory.

This year Allegri has more than proved himself as a top coach. Even with a vastly superior squad, everyone's favourite Ancelotti couldn't beat him in a single game in two attempts, forget on overall score.

I don't think it's the 4 CMs issue. It's not about personnel but approach.

I'd personally have expected him to go for a cataneccio style tbh as that's what worked for him in the past against Barca. Trying to beat them at their own game will never work, which is what I felt Juve were trying to do and failing at and is what caused them to be put under so much pressure for long periods of the game

I'll never agree with you about Allegri as his showings with us, even when he had a top team showed a very limited and clueless tactician. I do agree that he's surpassed on what I expected from him as I had Juve going as far as the quarters only. And I do think that he's doing MUCH better work at Juve than he ever did at Milan, even when we won the Scudetto, most of the results were heavily reliant on one player to bail us out, while there's none of that at Juve now. Although once again, I have to look towards Conte for most of that praise as the team was built by him and Allegri was very smart to continue to build on that

At Juve he had a very solid foundation to work on, while with us he took over a mostly blank slate that he had to put an identity to, and never managed to do so

[Fillipo Simone]

Ancelotti a lucky coach? The better coached team won? Oh come on Acid, you can do better (I'll respond to your post more extensively as soon as I'm able to).

[acid911]

Ancelotti a lucky coach? The better coached team won? Oh come on Acid, you can do better (I'll respond to your post more extensively as soon as I'm able to).

Looking forward to it, my friend. I'm very much due a lengthy discussion or two. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) But yeah, if you ask me Ancelotti is the luckiest coach around these days. That's not to say that he does not possess all the necessary skills that make a good tactician, he certainly does. But his luck factor outweighs all his other aspects.

At least, the way I see it. And that's why I have never placed him in my great coaches category, which is reserved for only the best of the best. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif) Then again, only a few individuals are there in that list, almost all of them not requiring a large overlay of an investment to bring home the bacon.

Thing with Ancelotti is, for me, he has disappointed just when I expected him to lift his game, lift his teams alongside. And when has has won, more often than not, it has got to do with the players at his disposal. You take them out, and he starts to falter. Not the sign of a great coach. Even with all his continental wins, which I'm not disputing.

So in that sense, I'm mighty glad that he's not back. I expected him to say no, that 50-50 thing was only a smokescreen. Plus I have serious issues with coaches that are not good at man management. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) Just rewind the clocks to how Ancelotti treated Shevchenko upon his return.

Who I rate much more highly for his time here in our colors than Ancelotti. Being a senior, more experienced individual, Carlo should have known better rather than indulge in a petty feud with the club icon. Not to say, Sheva might not have been on fault there, but come on, Calrlo, you're top of the food chain for a reason.

Besides, the 2005 loss was more due to his rigid tactics after half time, than the Sheva miss (or his performance in the penalty shootout). Ancelotti should either have gone in all attacking like Sacchi said to the 1994 team, or gone in water tight defense, moving Maldini to the center and making the correct substitutions.

Instead he just went with the flow. Just like the 4-0 loss to Deportivo de La Coruña. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cry.gif) That was stingy! We'll discuss this further, surely, but I personally think it was possible to win five consecutive CL titles (or three at least) with the state of affairs of world football in the early to mid 2000s, and the squad we had.

Practically the most gifted assembly of the biggest names in the game. Dida, Nesta, Maldini, Sheva, Kaka, Rui Costa, Seedorf, Pirlo on a pitch at the same time? Tell me one other team that had such talents at its disposal in the past two decades. And that's not even talking about the bench.

Only the original Galacticos put up a fight, but they don't come close to just how solid this group of players was. We did taste a lot of success, for which I am more than grateful. But we also squandered a lot of opportunities, which our coaches in the late 80s and early 90s did not. Hence their iconic status.

[acid911]

Although once again, I have to look towards Conte for most of that praise as the team was built by him and Allegri was very smart to continue to build on that

Agreed. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/king.gif) It takes a special someone to build something. Anyone can drive a car! Well almost anyone, no matter if their driving is good or bad. But to have the vision and foresight to get the project off the ground, well that's special. And this Juventus still is a Conte affair. Allegri did well in taking it forward.

Just like that Chelsea that Ancelotti managed was a Mourinho assembly, and even this Madrid. Then again, Real Madrid is pretty much a circus, where performers come and go. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) Not a team, just a squad. And besides, Carlo benched almost all of the Mourinho favorites right after he came, the likes of Khedira, Coentrão and friends.

At Juve he had a very solid foundation to work on, while with us he took over a mostly blank slate that he had to put an identity to, and never managed to do so

Not to mention that the way we sold all our players in one window also added another factor to the mix. Out of all our recent coaches, I felt Leo had the installed the most passion, and Seedorf, the most tactical planning. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) Allegri and Inzaghi seemed like they were just happy to be here.

That said, both Leo and Seedorf, novices that they were, had a lot of faults too.

[han2503]

acid, I have to say that I don't agree about Carlo being lucky at all

I don't think you can call someone who's won domestic titles in Italy, France and England plus 3 CL titles (the only coach around right now with that record) lucky

The man is simply a great tactician.

[acid911]

Ah, I said a good tactician, plus lucky. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif) In terms of things going his way off the field, that is. Expensive squads, historic teams and in case of PSG and Chelsea, owners throwing money to win trophies. When things have been tough, I do find him quite lacking in terms of coaching and man management abilities.

That's probably one of the main reasons why he has not won as much as he could have. 3 league titles in 18 years of coaching, primarily big teams. We all know how he squandered chances with Juventus and with us too. But even with these doubts that I have, Carlo makes the list of good coaches, and besides, no one can take his wins away.