[Danny]

But it's true. This season's Dortmund and Monaco were hardly worthy opponents. I don't care if they both beat Arsenal, they're just not good enough.

That's me told! You basically don't care if it defends Allegri!

And I say those stats you bring don't reflect reality. Yes, Conte failed last season in Europe, no doubt. But let's compare the first seasons for each manager.

Why?

Conte won the league and got them in the CL QFs, where they faced Bayern. Allegri is making them win the league (who cares by how many points, geez!) and got them in the CL semis, but having faced the weakest side of the eight in the QFs. That's all the difference, and why I say the opponent you get matters, a lot.

Guess we can kiss goodbye to our 2007 UCL then. Our group was a shitey Lille, AEK and Anderlecht, before Celtic last 16, then that weak Bayern of 2007 (they finished 4th in the league) and only then did we face a decent Man Utd before the perenially cr*p Benitez Liverpool.

Is this really the logic you want to go with?

[X-Offender]

Why?

Because you can't compare one season with two seasons, duh. And it makes more sense to compare their first ones in the CL as Juve managers.

Guess we can kiss goodbye to our 2007 UCL then. Our group was a shitey Lille, AEK and Anderlecht, before Celtic last 16, then that weak Bayern of 2007 (they finished 4th in the league) and only then did we face a decent Man Utd before the perenially cr*p Benitez Liverpool.

Is this really the logic you want to go with?

Yes.

It's no surprise, we had a relatively easy run that season in the CL, one of the main reasons we actually won the thing. I've had Inter fans thrown that to my face many times. But we still won. Let's see what Juventus does.

[han2503]

Guess we can kiss goodbye to our 2007 UCL then. Our group was a shitey Lille, AEK and Anderlecht, before Celtic last 16, then that weak Bayern of 2007 (they finished 4th in the league) and only then did we face a decent Man Utd before the perenially cr*p Benitez Liverpool.

Is this really the logic you want to go with?

Winning the CL is just as much about luck as it is about how good you are

In 07 we had already started our decline, the league exposed how much we were already struggling.

But yes, we were very lucky with the draws, with only United being a real challenge for us. But you have to admit that we seriously brought it in some of those games leading to the final. The Bayern away game and the United home game were truly some of the best football we've played under Carlo. When I think about a perfect football match the game against United and the game against Liverpool in 05 (minus the 6 minute blip) are the ones that instantly come to mind for me.

And yes so far Juve have been very lucky, and if they were to WIN it, absolutely no one would care how they got there, but the fact is that they most likely won't and Allegri getting them one step further than Conte did because he was dealt an extra hand of luck ultimately means nothing. And if they lose both legs it won't matter in co-efficient points either.

[kurtsimonw]

And yes so far Juve have been very lucky, and if they were to WIN it, absolutely no one would care how they got there, but the fact is that they most likely won't and Allegri getting them one step further than Conte did because he was dealt an extra hand of luck ultimately means nothing.

Because Dortmund and Monaco are easier than Galatasary and Copenhagen.

I love how when Allegri is doing well, there's excuses galore for everything. When Carlo sucks it up it's "Well he focused on the CL" When it's pointed out we mostly played bad opposition in the CL, there's more excuses. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

You just need to admit you're wrong on this and move on, no wonder hardly anyone posts.

[Danny]

Yeah I'm done here.

[X-Offender]

Because Dortmund and Monaco are easier than Galatasary and Copenhagen.

I love how when Allegri is doing well, there's excuses galore for everything. When Carlo sucks it up it's "Well he focused on the CL" When it's pointed out we mostly played bad opposition in the CL, there's more excuses. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

You just need to admit you're wrong on this and move on, no wonder hardly anyone posts.

But Conte did fail in his second CL spell, no-one is claiming otherwise. And Allegri is doing well for Juve, that's obvious. The fact that he was given a proven and established team is another undeniable fact.

What we're talking about here is his path through the CL, which, like it or not, has been facilitated by picking affordable opponents. If he had gotten Barça in the Ro16 he'd most probably be already out, and you wouldn't be talking like that.

[X-Offender]

Anyway,

Barça-Bayern
Juve-Real

Juve can make it. Madrid are not unbeatable, but they must put 101% in both games.

The other game is going to be glorious.

[han2503]

Because Dortmund and Monaco are easier than Galatasary and Copenhagen.

I love how when Allegri is doing well, there's excuses galore for everything. When Carlo sucks it up it's "Well he focused on the CL" When it's pointed out we mostly played bad opposition in the CL, there's more excuses. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

You just need to admit you're wrong on this and move on, no wonder hardly anyone posts.

How am I wrong exactly?

And where did I not admit that we were very lucky that last time that we won the CL?

The only time you'll see me admitting to being wrong about Allegri is if he ever achieved anything when he did not have the absolute best team.

I said from the start that Juve will win the league by November, which they practically did, has nothing to do with Allegri but the quality they have compared to the rest of the league

I predicted a quarter final run in the CL. And you can't say they weren't lucky, coming in second in their group (barely scraping through might I add) usually devises a terrible path to the final for most teams. Instead they were handed the weakest of the group winners and then followed that with the weakest team that was left in the knock outs for the quarter finals. And once again they barely got through on a penalty and some seriously dirty play in the away leg.

If Juve lose some of their best players this summer we'll talk more about Allegri

Until then, when I think of him I think of some of the worst football that Milan had played up until that point since I've been watching (Pippo probably taking that cake now, but it's still cutting it close), I still remember how he lost a title that he should have breezed through, and I remember his last season with us were we were an utter horror show.

You excuse him because he lost his star players, but would you also excuse him if he lost his stars at Juve and plummeted them as well?

This is probably the only place on the internet where I actually see Allegri getting defended as a good coach. You and Danny being the only cases on this forum

[X-Offender]

Aaaaaand we're talking about Allegri again. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[han2503]

Anyway,

Barça-Bayern
Juve-Real

Juve can make it. Madrid are not unbeatable, but they must put 101% in both games.

The other game is going to be glorious.

Don't know about that. I think Real are one step too far for them

They obviously have some very clear weaknesses but this is the first real top notch, undoubtedly top class team Juve will have faced all season. I think it will be something akin to a culture shock for them when they face Real

[Danny]

Aaaaaand we're talking about Allegri again. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Aren't we always!

Sort of distracts from the absolutely abominable season we're having overall.

[han2503]

Aren't we always!

Sort of distracts from the absolutely abominable season we're having overall.

Well we basically have nothing left to discuss, even match threads are absolutely dead at this point.

The only thing left to discuss that is actually about Milan is a possible take over and even that is seemingly about to turn into another winded story.

I read on forbes that Bee isn't even rich enough to front the money that's being talked about

[Forza Milan!]

Well we basically have nothing left to discuss, even match threads are absolutely dead at this point.

The only thing left to discuss that is actually about Milan is a possible take over and even that is seemingly about to turn into another winded story.

I read on forbes that Bee isn't even rich enough to front the money that's being talked about

Interesting discussion on Allegri :-). Have to confess that I am starting to wonder if I have been wrong about him, and perhaps some of the "poor decisions" we have blamed on him were the result of pressure from B or G. I don't give him much credit for Serie A, as the scudetto was his to lose (as it was in his first two years at Milan). But even accounting for quality of opponents, getting to the semis in CL is an achievement. Will see how it goes from there, don't think they can get past Real (but you never know).

As for Bee, I have been wondering about him as well. Sounds like we may be better off if the Chinese buy us. But, either way, something needs to happen, can't take one more year of this ...

[han2503]

Interesting discussion on Allegri :-). Have to confess that I am starting to wonder if I have been wrong about him, and perhaps some of the "poor decisions" we have blamed on him were the result of pressure from B or G. I don't give him much credit for Serie A, as the scudetto was his to lose (as it was in his first two years at Milan). But even accounting for quality of opponents, getting to the semis in CL is an achievement. Will see how it goes from there, don't think they can get past Real (but you never know).

As for Bee, I have been wondering about him as well. Sounds like we may be better off if the Chinese buy us. But, either way, something needs to happen, can't take one more year of this ...

It's no secret that Silvio hated Allegri, but he was loved by Galliani and the only reason he lasted for so long was because of that fact. For me, his decisions and tactical incompetency was down to himself alone and no one else. I don't think Galliani was pressuring him to play Urby as an AM...

What he's doing with Juve now so far for me has been as I expected since he went there. He hasn't really pushed outside of the realm of what most people expected from him either

[Danny]

Well we basically have nothing left to discuss, even match threads are absolutely dead at this point.

The only thing left to discuss that is actually about Milan is a possible take over and even that is seemingly about to turn into another winded story.

I read on forbes that Bee isn't even rich enough to front the money that's being talked about

MS report he wants Klopp.