[kurtsimonw]

Rino is a pretty terrible player, that's why I'm surprised anyone else would want him.

[Jack Sparrow]

Yeah well...like I said... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)



(IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

[CHU-LIP]

Thank you Gattuso for a great match and an awesome season so far. You are our spark in midfield, everyone who thinks about benching you are wrong.

Flamini?

He's nothing compared to our very own beast Gennaro Ivan Gattuso! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/onesmiley1.gif)

[vnata001]

Thank you Gattuso for a great match and an awesome season so far. You are our spark in midfield, everyone who thinks about benching you are wrong.

Flamini?

He's nothing compared to our very own beast Gennaro Ivan Gattuso! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/onesmiley1.gif)

CHU, I have to ask you. In all of the strongest teams in the world at this very moment, how many defensive midfielders are strictly ball winners? All of today's strongest teams field defensive midfielders who are capable not only of winning the ball, but ALSO performing some technical services. Granted, while Rino's work rate is inspirational, and I appreciate how he DIES on the field for our colors, but...

how many more times can you stand to see one of our short spells of possession ruined by Rino's complete attacking incompetence. How many of his lofted through balls actually come off? (and don't say yesterday's to Inzaghi, cuz it was offside) How many times have you seen a ball come to his feet outside the eighteen, only for him to play the ball right at the feet of a defender, while an easier passing option was available? Or when he finds himself in good shooting positions, his shots rarely even test the keeper.

Then ask yourself how many times a player like, say Mascherano (who has defensive characteristics similar to those of Gattuso, and slightly BETTER technical qualities) tried such things. Mascherano would simply defer to Gerrard and Alonso at all costs. Yaya Toure, Khedira, Obi Mikel, Alex Song, Michael Essien, Busquets are no such liabilities when their team is attacking, in fact their useful! All of them pop up with goals and assists, IN ADDITION to willing the ball and breaking up opposition play..

The players like Rino, the kind of players that Mascherano/Poulsen (to name a few) no longer see playing time. Poulsen was a bench warmer on a BAD Juve, and now he is at a BAD Liverpool. And Mascherano, while admittedly excellent at Liverpool, has gone to Barcelona and NEVER plays.

You must realize that not only have Rino's abilities (NOT talking about his heart/fire) diminished, but football has changed from a few years ago. Defensive midfielders in Rino's mold are a disappearing breed. They must be more versatile!

This post has been edited by vnata001: Nov 4 2010, 07:24 PM

[Fillipo Simone]

Bah, I've heard that story about football changing and so on...but still, I rate Rino. Maybe you think he's a disappearing breed, but - Gattuso still is class and I'm more happy with him around with a "modern" DM who in the end turns up useless for any occasion.

[vnata001]

Bah, I've heard that story about football changing and so on...but still, I rate Rino. Maybe you think he's a disappearing breed, but - Gattuso still is class and I'm more happy with him around with a "modern" DM who in the end turns up useless for any occasion.

well as long as we have a 3-man midfield, then you and Allegri can watch our midfield with Gattuso flounder. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

So you don't rate the way Yaya Toure, Khedira, Obi Mikel, Alex Song, Michael Essien, Busquets, or the old Patrick Vieria plays? I'd take defensive midfielders like them over Poulsen/Mascherano/Gattuso any day, regardless of how good the latter were during their primes.

Granted, the Rino/Poulsen/Masch are good at being bodyguards of deep-lying play makers. So when next to a Alonso or Pirlo type, they can work when in a four-man midfield. Just because they can work there, does not mean that one of the other, more versatile DMs still wouldn't be better bodyguards. (Khedira>Diarra to protect Alonso, Busquets>Mascherano to protect Xavi - no coincidence.) And when in a 3-man midfield (Obi Mikel @ chelsea), there's no debate as to which kind is more useful.

This post has been edited by vnata001: Nov 4 2010, 08:29 PM

[han2503]

Imo it has nothing to do with football changing, but more to do with Rino just not being good as a player anymore. Age has taken it's toll on Rino not to mention all the injuries he's had in recent years. Rino burnt himself out giving his all for this team and I'll forever love that Rino, and imo he's still useful as a behind the scenes player, but on the pitch we have better options these days, simply because Rino is not cutting it anymore.

Would I love to see Rino really perform like Rino can? The Rino of 5 years ago? I would absolutely love that, imo that Rino would blow any other DM out of the water, and is first pick for us without hesitation, but that Rino simply does not exist anymore.

@ vnata, if Mascherano was in the group of DMs that are a dying breed, then why did Barca spend all that cash on him?

[X-Offender]

Imo it has nothing to do with football changing, but more to do with Rino just not being good as a player anymore. Age has taken it's toll on Rino not to mention all the injuries he's had in recent years. Rino burnt himself out giving his all for this team and I'll forever love that Rino, and imo he's still useful as a behind the scenes player, but on the pitch we have better options these days, simply because Rino is not cutting it anymore.

Ditto. I'd gladly keep him as a sub, playing against smaller opponents or when someone's injured. But every three days (and out of position) like he's being utilized right now? No, thank you.

[vnata001]

Imo it has nothing to do with football changing, but more to do with Rino just not being good as a player anymore. Age has taken it's toll on Rino not to mention all the injuries he's had in recent years. Rino burnt himself out giving his all for this team and I'll forever love that Rino, and imo he's still useful as a behind the scenes player, but on the pitch we have better options these days, simply because Rino is not cutting it anymore.

Would I love to see Rino really perform like Rino can? The Rino of 5 years ago? I would absolutely love that, imo that Rino would blow any other DM out of the water, and is first pick for us without hesitation, but that Rino simply does not exist anymore.

@ vnata, if Mascherano was in the group of DMs that are a dying breed, then why did Barca spend all that cash on him?

you want ME to rationalize the moves that Barca makes on the transfer market?! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif) they threw away eto'o for Ibra, threw away Ibra for Villa, and lost hundreds of mil in the process.

and in any case, Mascherano has stronger technical abilities than Rino ever had. He can pass well over short distances, and pretty damn well over long distances -already two things Rino never had. He can shoot from distance, something Rino has never had.

Due to the questionable career choice he made to leave a team in which he was fundamental, to a team where he's a bench player, says nothing about his qualities as a player. Barca spent on a good player, he made a stupid choice. But the point is as good as he is, why is he third in the pecking order behind Keita and Busqets? Because the latter two's greater tactical flexibility.

Mascherano at his peak was a more well-rounded player than Rino ever was. Equally the biting terrier, while simultaneously a better 'footballer'.

And if you honestly don't think it has anything to do with the time's changing, then please list out for me which of today's top teams employ one-dimensional, terrier-like DMs in the starting eleven, and who those players are.

And honestly, take a close look at the truly top teams: the premier league powers, Bayern, the two spanish powers, and inter. I would genuinely like you provide a list. In the modern game, there are a lot of players nowdays that possess BOTH imposing physicality AND technical ability, and it is these types of players you find employing the holding roles at top teams...

also, to the people insisting that even today he is still class:
did it occur to anyone that considering who Rino is, the kind of lovable guy he is, the fact that he's Italian, the important role he's had for us in the past, makes it hard for some people in milan fan circles to see that nowdays he's a little past it. I'd be interested to poll fans from across Europe's big teams and see how many of them would replace their current DM with Gattuso these days. I think we'd find the answer to be, not many. When he was rumored to be leaving, he was heading to Greece...

This post has been edited by vnata001: Nov 4 2010, 11:12 PM

[X-Offender]

When he was rumored to be leaving, he was heading to Greece...

And we all have to thank Allegri for not making that happen. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

[Fillipo Simone]

Oh, c'mmon, this is really rediculous! I mean, I watch Milan games too, and I understand Gattuso is not young and he lost much of his qualities. But don't push it to that point - it's not like we'd earn much from the transfer, and Rino all in all plays a good season. I get your points, but we don't need to push it beyond a line. Or are we really that desperate and want our team captain out that much?

[vnata001]

Oh, c'mmon, this is really rediculous! I mean, I watch Milan games too, and I understand Gattuso is not young and he lost much of his qualities. But don't push it to that point - it's not like we'd earn much from the transfer, and Rino all in all plays a good season. I get your points, but we don't need to push it beyond a line. Or are we really that desperate and want our team captain out that much?

Im not saying we SHOULD have sold him. The fact that he was headed to Greece, and not another top European team, was simply an illustration of what most around Europe perceive his level to be...Greece is where players go to retire (Rivaldo, Gilberto Silva, Govou, Cisse, etc.) Let's make no mistake, Rino was not headed to another elite European team. The example was only to illustrate that while a lot of Milan fans consider him "class" still, it could be more to do with what he's meant over time, rather than what he is today.

Rino may be playing better than he has for the last few seasons. Still, that does not excuse him taking time away from a player like Flamini, who has a lot more to contribute at this point in their respective careers! Much less does it excuse him being deployed as a box-to-box midfielder for 90 minutes, a position he's never had the technical abilities to play. It's exasperating. The honest question is, do you want to win in the present? or rather sacrifice the prime of other player's careers/maximizing our squad's potential just to give Rino his "due respect". We all respect Rino, but cycles come to and end, so has his.

Look 5 years ago, watching Rino filled me with pride. My gripes are not with Rino the man. They are with Milan management and our coaching staff. Rino will always live on as a club idol in the hearts of all Milanisti. However, there comes a time when yes, it is time to move on! He is past his best, Milan are a club of the highest ambitions, or so we are made to believe...

Real respectfully broke ways with their long-time captain Raul. They respect him no end, all the Madrid fans love him, but Raul and Madrid both came to a mutual understanding that their time of mutual dependence was gone. Raul still gets to enjoy the game he loves playing regularly in Germany. The fans will always love the man for the way he played for them, and won't have their image tainted of him because he did not stay past his peak and become a burden on the team's present success.

Anyways, it'd be interesting if anyone is willing to provide that list..

This post has been edited by vnata001: Nov 5 2010, 12:12 AM

[X-Offender]

Im not saying we SHOULD have sold him. The fact that he was headed to Greece, and not another top European team, was simply an illustration of what most around Europe perceive his level to be...Greece is where players go to retire (Rivaldo, Gilberto Silva, Govou, Cisse, etc.) Let's make no mistake, Rino was not headed to another elite European team. The example was only to illustrate that while a lot of Milan fans consider him "class" still, it could be more to do with what he's meant over time, rather than what he is today.

Rino may be playing better than he has for the last few seasons. Still, that does not excuse him taking time away from a player like Flamini, who has a lot more to contribute at this point in their respective careers! Much less does it excuse him being deployed as a box-to-box midfielder for 90 minutes, a position he's never had the technical abilities to play. It's exasperating. The honest question is, do you want to win in the present? or rather sacrifice the prime of other player's careers/maximizing our squad's potential just to give Rino his "due respect". We all respect Rino, but cycles come to and end, so has his.

Look 5 years ago, watching Rino filled me with pride. My gripes are not with Rino the man. They are with Milan management and our coaching staff. Rino will always live on as a club idol in the hearts of all Milanisti. However, there comes a time when yes, it is time to move on! He is past his best, Milan are a club of the highest ambitions, or so we are made to believe...

Real respectfully broke ways with their long-time captain Raul. They respect him no end, all the Madrid fans love him, but Raul and Madrid both came to a mutual understanding that their time of mutual dependence was gone. Raul still gets to enjoy the game he loves playing regularly in Germany. The fans will always love the man for the way he played for them, and won't have their image tainted of him because he did not stay past his peak and become a burden on the team's present success.

Anyways, it'd be interesting if anyone is willing to provide that list..

Once again, you make your point very clear, which I agree with 100%.

[samira]

Tantissimi Auguri Rino ! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Fillipo Simone]

33!