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> Serie A - Giornata 30 - Chievo Verona vs. AC Milan, Date: 30/03/2013 Time: 18:30 CET

 
Fillipo Simone
post Apr 2 2013, 10:14 AM
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Oh and yes, here's the new poll
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han2503
post Apr 2 2013, 12:55 PM
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QUOTE (Fillipo Simone @ Apr 2 2013, 10:08 AM) *
What? You call him average and selfish? And you think Niang is better? Or Robinho? Seriously?

I can't get you guys. Why are you so fiercely trying to invent stuff? Why are we debating Nocerino's laziness in training? How on earth can we know who's doing good and giving his best and who's slipping behind? Yet we make these shots in the dark while ignoring certain facts we already established.

Like for example that Allegri is a awful man-manager and that his skills in terms of motivating certain players are on Serie C level. We know that a bunch of senators whom I respect a great deal more then Allegri have spoken against him: Nesta, Gattuso, Inzaghi. We know that some players who failed even in the slightest possible way never ever managed to regain their faith with the coach: Sokratis, Taiwo, Ronaldinho, Pirlo, etc. We know that some players made grave mistakes, yet managed not to be eliminated even after repeating their mistakes.

And you guys seriously speak about training issues? You think it's worth pressing for Allegri and covering him? For what? I expect a coach to make the best out of what he's handed. But Allegri discards some of his players much to easily. And that is a bad sign. Ancelotti, Capello or Sacchi wouldn't have done the same thing, not in this fashion.

And don't start me on that 18 matches with just 1 lost. Are you really satisfied with Milan? You guys think this is the best we can play and get?

Brilliant post!!

I give up with some people. We talk about Muntari as if he's Iniesta and Niang as if he's f@cking Messi. What's the point!
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post Apr 2 2013, 02:00 PM
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QUOTE (Fillipo Simone @ Apr 2 2013, 12:08 PM) *
What? You call him average and selfish? And you think Niang is better? Or Robinho? Seriously?

I can't get you guys. Why are you so fiercely trying to invent stuff? Why are we debating Nocerino's laziness in training? How on earth can we know who's doing good and giving his best and who's slipping behind? Yet we make these shots in the dark while ignoring certain facts we already established.

Like for example that Allegri is a awful man-manager and that his skills in terms of motivating certain players are on Serie C level. We know that a bunch of senators whom I respect a great deal more then Allegri have spoken against him: Nesta, Gattuso, Inzaghi. We know that some players who failed even in the slightest possible way never ever managed to regain their faith with the coach: Sokratis, Taiwo, Ronaldinho, Pirlo, etc. We know that some players made grave mistakes, yet managed not to be eliminated even after repeating their mistakes.

And you guys seriously speak about training issues? You think it's worth pressing for Allegri and covering him? For what? I expect a coach to make the best out of what he's handed. But Allegri discards some of his players much to easily. And that is a bad sign. Ancelotti, Capello or Sacchi wouldn't have done the same thing, not in this fashion.

And don't start me on that 18 matches with just 1 lost. Are you really satisfied with Milan? You guys think this is the best we can play and get?


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kurtsimonw
post Apr 2 2013, 04:41 PM
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QUOTE (han2503 @ Mar 31 2013, 10:26 PM) *
Sometimes it's as simple as a coach preferring one player over another. In this case, Allegri for some ODD reason has always liked and preferred Muntari over MUCH better options.

Football is very simple. As a coach you put a team out that will win you games. The start of the season was truly awful and Nocerino was particularly shocking. Since Muntari has came into the side we've been a much better team, there's no denying that results with Muntari > results with Nocerino. This isn't fantasy footbaoo, you don't just pick 11 players and win, they have to play well together. Do you think the likes of Barry, Hargreaves, etc. are better than Gerrard or Lampard? They aren't even close, but the fact is with Barry alongside one of them, it worked far better than when they played together. Sometimes the best players don't make the best team.

I'd rather we play Nocerino. But we rarely ever lose, so I don't care who plays. Allegri is getting it right.

@Fillipo. I couldn't note reply to this. You say people are making stuff up to fit an arguement and you mention Gattuso against Allegri when he literally confirmed it's not true and he had no problems with him just the other day.

This post has been edited by kurtsimonw: Apr 2 2013, 04:42 PM
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Fillipo Simone
post Apr 2 2013, 07:20 PM
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No, Gattuso said he never left because of Allegri explicitly and he never had a fight. Yet he also said:

QUOTE
“The locker room was out of control in the last two or three months with things I’d never seen in 13 years with the Rossoneri.”

“The rules were no longer respected and the older players, who were irritated, no longer had the strength or the willpower to tell their teammates off. At that point I realised it was time to leave, even though the contract renewal was already prepared.

“When we had training at 9.30am, many arrived just 10 minutes beforehand and nobody would say anything. I’d arrive 45 minutes early in order to do some exercises, get a massage or even just to relax with a cup of coffee. That’s the sporting culture you get after years of experience.

“Or, when we had lunch at 13.00, some turned up 15 minutes late. There was no respect for the rules.

“If in a group of 25 players the rules are not respected, then it’s immediately chaos. These are things that sap energy from the older players too, as they get irritated at wasting time criticising the others.

“The thing that really annoyed me was that nobody said anything. I no longer felt like Rino Gattuso in that locker room, so I realised it was time to leave.”


So unless France Football invented this whole interview, my interpretations stands.
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kurtsimonw
post Apr 2 2013, 09:27 PM
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He doesn't mentioned Allegri.
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post Apr 2 2013, 09:27 PM
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QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Apr 2 2013, 11:27 PM) *
He doesn't mentioned Allegri.


You're joking, right?
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han2503
post Apr 2 2013, 09:55 PM
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QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Apr 2 2013, 04:41 PM) *
Football is very simple. As a coach you put a team out that will win you games. The start of the season was truly awful and Nocerino was particularly shocking. Since Muntari has came into the side we've been a much better team, there's no denying that results with Muntari > results with Nocerino. This isn't fantasy footbaoo, you don't just pick 11 players and win, they have to play well together. Do you think the likes of Barry, Hargreaves, etc. are better than Gerrard or Lampard? They aren't even close, but the fact is with Barry alongside one of them, it worked far better than when they played together. Sometimes the best players don't make the best team.

I'd rather we play Nocerino. But we rarely ever lose, so I don't care who plays. Allegri is getting it right.

This argument you make about one player effecting the results is probably the cheapest one you've ever made and you also used it to justify why Yepes should be playng ahead of Zapata as well. It's just a ridiculous argument to even attempt to make.

We're getting results first and foremost because Allegri stopped messing around with every formation in the book and stuck to a core group of players instead of switching said formation and 11 players each week. At one point he was changing the starting CB pairing each week, which is probably the biggest idiotic move you can make, especially when you're struggling. We're also doing better because our important players are performing when at the start of the season they simply weren't. We also have Balo now. And sometimes it simply falls back on stupid luck. Sometimes it's against you and sometimes things go your way and you cannot deny that luck hasn't turned our way in these last 4 months or so, where as at the beginning things weren't happening for us at all.

Muntari? We're achieving the results DESPITE having him muck around in midfield, barely bothering to jog and cover spaces, passing directly to opponents, putting us under pressure, etc. The point is we can be better in that midfield if Flamini or Nocerino play instead of him. At this point Muntari or Nocerino, we'd still most likely win most games against the Chievos of this league. But the point is we'd do that a lot better withou having to carry his dead weight along for the ride. It's just terrible to watch him in our shirt, f@cking everything up while Allegri gives him a free pass to enjoy the ride. It just grates on my nerves, watching him play p!sses me off because he's that bad a player and Allegri has the luxury of better options but decides to close an eye to them
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kurtsimonw
post Apr 2 2013, 10:00 PM
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QUOTE (han2503 @ Apr 2 2013, 10:55 PM) *
This argument you make about one player effecting the results is probably the cheapest one you've ever made and you also used it to justify why Yepes should be playng ahead of Zapata as well. It's just a ridiculous argument to even attempt to make.

I've never used it to justify anything. I'm just stating a fact and while that fact continues I'm not going to complain.
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han2503
post Apr 2 2013, 10:52 PM
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QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Apr 2 2013, 10:00 PM) *
I've never used it to justify anything. I'm just stating a fact and while that fact continues I'm not going to complain.

But the fact doesn't make any sense in terms of the argument, just like when you used it to justify the choice of playing the horrible Yepes over Zapata or even Mexes (when Bonera was still the undisputed (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) starter)

Can't you for once just say that Allegri is making a wrong decision by playing Muntari constantly when he's been terrible in basically every game he's played? Had it been Carlo or Leo you would have no trouble criticising the sh!t out of them, yet with Allegri you try to justify every decision by whipping out some ridiculous fact as if winning hinges on playing Muntari ((IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) ), no matter how terrible that decision is, whether that's Urby behind the strikers, starting Yepes over much better options, same with Muntari, same with Niang and the list goes on.
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post Apr 2 2013, 10:56 PM
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Yeah Kurt, it's time for you to let it go. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)
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William405
post Apr 3 2013, 05:35 AM
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Seriously, you can twist around a fact to make him sound like he's doing good for us. It might work for people who don't watch the games but not..us ;P
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CHU-LIP
post Apr 3 2013, 12:26 PM
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QUOTE (Fillipo Simone @ Apr 2 2013, 12:08 PM) *
What? You call him average and selfish? And you think Niang is better? Or Robinho? Seriously?

I am just not having it with Bojan, thus I could understand when a very young Niang is getting the chance instead.

Robinho is obvously better, that is when he was motivated. His time seems over here.
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Fillipo Simone
post Apr 3 2013, 02:26 PM
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Niang is 18 and Bojan 22. Why would a player like Niang get the chance over Bojan? Because he's younger? That does not make sense to me.
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han2503
post Apr 3 2013, 04:05 PM
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QUOTE (CHU-LIP @ Apr 3 2013, 12:26 PM) *
I am just not having it with Bojan, thus I could understand when a very young Niang is getting the chance instead.

Robinho is obvously better, that is when he was motivated. His time seems over here.

What are you not having with Bojan? The fact that everytime he was given over a meager 20 minutes on the pitch he impressed? While Niang has been given ample amount of time this season and underwhelmed for the majority of minutes on the pitch. Your fascination with young players really makes no sense. So what if a players is young or old, what matters is what they bring to the pitch, and I'm sorry but Niang is just plain bad and does not deserve half the time he's been awarded.

Out of those 3 Bojan is the obviously better player in all senses of the word, Robinho can barely be considered a player anymore.

And you seriously want to talk motivation and selfishness in the context of Niang??
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