D. Lopez; Abate, Paletta, Mexes, Antonelli; De Jong, Poli, Suso; Cerci, Destro, Menez

Mediaset

Might be the only midfield we have (if it's 4-3-3) but it's actually a half decent one.

I've gone hugely off Bonaventura - he's really a very average player who works so hard but has very little actual talent.

De Jong and Poli is absolutely fine, and Suso in front of them is a pretty useful option.

It probably WILL be 4-2-3-1 with Destroy supported by Menez, Cerci, and Suso mind you.

And the defence...it's been patchy. But the best two fullbacks we have are there and while Paletta Mexes is not our strongest CB pairing it's far from our weakest either.

Bona has been one of our best players this season, can't see how you could come to that conclusion, after - yes, admittedly 2 very bad games. His performances overall throughout the season have been good, and he's been important to the team.

Yes, he is a bit of a Jack of all Trades, but imo he's better than Poli in all areas.

I still think he'd be good as part of a trio if he has a proper creator next to him

He's been one of our most committed and his attitude has been excellent, but can you explain where he excels?

In my description in the player thread, he seems to be a link man - available, makes space, and connects midfield to attack by lieu of anchoring.

But he doesn't have much talent. He lacks pace, he lacks strength, little to no creativity and can't shoot for toffee.

Poli has shown more skill on the ball than he has, and that's pretty indicting.

This all sounds like I hate Bona. Far from it. He has mental strength, he's committed, he gives everything and leaves it all out there. I have genuine respect for him.

But he's not the kind of player we need moving forward. Just isn't good enough.

I don't agree with your assessment there. Yes, he's not Kaká, but he doesn't lack pace. Strength-wise he's average, and he's scored a couple of goals from shots outside the box this season. And no way in hell is Poli more skilled on the ball than him.

He doesn't excel in any particular area, but he's a good and reliable player, and like Han said, if he had quality players to rely on, his utility would come to shine. Kinda of like when Nocerino looked like a beast next to Ibra, only that unlike Nocerino, Bona hasn't been sucking big time when he doesn't have that kind of support.

I find Poli and Bona quite similar overall. I definitely agree with your final statement though. These kind of players who don't necessarily excel in any particular category can be very capable players in good teams, the problem is when they are meant to be one of the better players they aren't going to be able to control a game

This is my point - I never said he's a bad player, I said I had personally overrated him, and that he isn't good enough to move forward with.

As an additional player in a MUCH stronger Milan, yeah, he'd be fine, a utility player like Noce. I agree there.

But in this Milan he can't do much to improve us.

Agreed

I think we're all essentially saying the same thing here. Danny, your initial point about him was a bit in the extreme, that's why I think it sparked the debate

Like I said, he's a Jack of all Trades just like Poli is, but imo Bona is better than Poli in basically every area, not by much, but he's definitely better, even if they essentially do similar things

But as everyone has pointed out, for us to get the best out of Bona we need to have better players around him that he can play off of.

He's not the type of player that's good enough to build around, but he is the type of player that would make an excellent piece of the overall puzzle if the quality is there

"He's really a very average player who works so hard but has very little actual talent."

Can anyone tell me what's wrong with this statement? I don't see it as remotely extreme, Bona is NOT very talented, and by our normal levels he's thoroughly average.



He wouldn't play if the quality was there. He'd be on the bench mostly.

He's decent enough for the level we're at right now, but the bigger picture exposes his mediocrity in the context of good players for what it is.

Poli is very similar, but is better at dribbling. And off-ball work.

Neither are of the level we need though.

But I respect both players - they have the heart guys like Menez lack all to often.

Apparently both Bona and MvG have recovered from their respective injuries.

I was mostly referring to the part where you said you've gone off him. as an extreme.

I think we all knew that he wasn't top level even when we signed him, he's a good player imo, I don't think he's disappointed or over achieved.


Sure if we had a squad filled with top class players circa the Carlo era, he'd be on the bench, but that's never going to happen again.

What I meant was if we had for example 3 or 4 top class players (should management change in the summer) and the rest of the team comprised of guys like Bona, Alex, Abate, etc, I think it would be a good mix.

We're never going to have a team brimming with top talent again, what we can do is bring in 2 or 3 top players that we can build the team around, and Bona imo would be one of those players

I consider Abate a marquee player, the quality that, if we had more like him, we'd be nearer where we should be.

He, Lopez, De Jong, Menez and Destro are the quality we need universally in the team.

Sure if what we aspired to was only to get into the European spots.

If we want better than that we need top class, not just good to great which is where I'd fit all those players in the player scale

I thought you rated Abate higher than this.

I do, I think he's one of the best in his position in this league and in terms of RBs out there right now.

I think he's a great player, but I wouldn't call him top class. For me when I think of a top class FB, Paolo, Zambrotta, etc come to mind, I don't think Abate is anywhere near that

Different eras, different standards.

No one around today of that level.

Best FBs are probably Zabaleta (albeit had a poor season despite his stellar world cup), Gaya and Alba. And, IMO, Abate.

So, when I say 'Milan class', I don't mean the Milan of old. That's dead and gone. But taken into context of today, and how good we can be with the best players we can realistically get again, Abate covers RB. We don't need to get a better one.

And for me, Destro, Lopez, De Jong and Menez are similar.

But elsewhere, MAYBE Antonelli excluded (he's done terrifically), we're thoroughly mediocre and that's why we're where we are.

I agree with Danny here. Given the quality of today's fullbacks, Abate is more than fine for us.

I don't think you guys understood my initial point though.

I think Abate is more than good enough for us. I think he's one of the best RBs around right now, but I wouldn't call him world class or top class, that's what I was trying to say.

For me when saying world class I think of players like Ronaldo, Messi, Ibra, Thiago, etc. abate is simply not there, even when I don't compare his to players from another era

No sh*t, Sherlock!

I class him as world class. I class the players you mention as the world's best.

The distinction, for me, is any player who looks at ease and completely comfortable (and able to excel to an extent) at ANY level, for club and country, is world class, while those who create new boundaries of brilliance are the best.

For me, right now, the world's best are Silva, Neuer, Ronaldo, Lahm, Messi, Ibra, Suarez, Neymar, Robben, Modric and a few others.

But 'world class' includes any superb player who could probably play for any team, even if they won't break records or win Ballon D'Or.

I think this is just a matter of perception and what your personal scale for measuring a player's ability is

For me, there is no difference when saying world class, top class, world's best, they all mean the same thing and I classify those players you listed under all three terms interchangeably.

That's why I don't Put Abate in that bracket but in the one below it

But you hear the term 'world class' used commonly in culture to describe players who clearly aren't as good as the Ronaldos and Messis of this world.

And here's another point. You include Silva as world class, yet he's won only three league titles, a few cups, no individual honours, and nothing with his country. Meanwhile you class him alongside 3 times Ballon D'Or, 2 times UCL winner, 4 times EPL and La Liga winner Ronaldo. Who has at least made a major championship final with his country.

Is that comparible?

This is why I don't believe you can interchange these terms as readily and lazily as you imply.

Semantically speaking I consider them to define tangible differences in ability.

I personally don't think looking at Ballon d'Or, and league titles/CLs.WCs factor into how great a player truly is.

Ibra, Ronaldo - Never won the champions league, meanwhile Brocchi has 2 winners medals.

Maldini - Never won a world cup, meawhile Roque Junior and Simone Barone have done so

I personally think ability is all that should factor into whether you consider a player world class, and imo, Silva is

If we win tonight we'll be 5 points from 5th place. It's now or never, let's see how the teams reacts.

Diego Lopez; Abate, Paletta, Mexes, Antonelli; Van Ginkel, De Jong, Bonaventura; Cerci, Destro, Menez

The best we have available, let's see what they're capable of when they have the slightest bit of expectations weighing on them

Yes. No excuses tonight.

My stream stopped working. Like, I had signal but the game footage wasn't there anymore. I tried another channel and it's the same thing. They're showing other stuff. Huh...

Apparently there's a blackout at San Siro.

They only stopped for a few minutes until the backup systems took over

My Italian is more than iffy, but from what I can understand it's a blackout in that area of Milan, not just in the stadium

Cerci has been sh*t.

F*ck Cerci, what a mediocre dud. Did nothing right.

Yep, to be fair the bounce of the ball is going completely against him, but his head down running, awful crossing and worse shooting have hindered more than helped our cause.

Menez and him both guilty of completely over running the ball when there are people in better positions to pass to, so frustrating to watch

...

0-1

Menez has been quite sh*t as well tonight.

DE JONG!!!

Looks serious for Destro

Pazzo replaces him

Paletta also

Suso >>>>>> Cerci

SO CLOSE Suso!!!

Off the post

Another big disappointment when there was something to actually hope for in this dire season

1-1

Guess that's bye bye to the EL.

A few notes:

Suso has more class than Honda and Cerci combined, and Inzaghi is a fecking noob for not playing him.

Menez is an individualistic piece of sh*t.

Cerci had perhaps one of the worst showings I've seen a Milan player ever put.

Individualistic piece of sh*t though Menez is, he's the reason we're not fighting relegation off.

I don't like him, he's not a team player, and he's got the same 'mememe' attitude that Balo did.

But can't argue with the stats.

Tonight was one of his broken x button nights, where his selfish play didn't lead to anything, where often it does. For himself, of course.

Cerci continues to disappoint - marginal improvement on his absolutely pathetic start, but nowhere near the Torino player he once was.

Destro cuts a frustrated figure as no one makes chances for him. Wrong player in the wrong team, a team whose balance is all off thanks to the manager.

Midfield was potentially our best, it's the one I've advocated since day one, despite my recent criticism of Bona. De Jong was decent, if not brilliant, but MvG was excellent. Bona was ordinary - going through a very poor spell right now.

Their goal was disgusting defending from Mexes & Abate. Mexes getting megged like that was embarrassing, and Abate was beaten completely all ends up.

Suso was the only good thing about that match, and Pippo's a c*nt of a man for never playing him. Legend of a player, simply horrible manager who has been a cancer on the Club since he took over. Powerful word but one I stand by.

I've never hated a Milan manager, but I do hate him.

He's just a stupid little joke of a man, and he should have done what MvB did at Alkmaar when he realised he wasn't up to it - just resign with dignity.

No, Pippo stays on and destroys this team further.

I'm separating the player from the manager, but I have to say it's getting harder to do so given how much he's destroying his legacy with every passing woeful piece of management.

That was mostly on Mexes. Abate was marking Okaka, whereas Mexes was "pressing" Eto'o outside the box and left his space completely open. It was an embarrassing goal to concede indeed.

True, Abate was marking his man, but would never have expected Eto'o to get past Mexes in such a comically easy way.

The question has to also be where Paletta and Antonelli were seeing as Abate was dragged to the centre to mark Okaka and Mexes was dragged up to cover Eto'o

Yes the nutmeg was ridiculous, but once again, it was a united fail from the defence

A defence which HAS been marginally better recently.

I think the teams we were playing against gave us that false perception imo

We're still as unorganised and uncoordinated as ever imo

Paletta was also having a terrible game imo at one point Okaka literally drifted right past him and he was barely aware of it.

Paletta is crap.