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Milan Are Brilliant

QUOTE
HOLDERS: Porto (Portuguese)

Europa League/UEFA Cup Recent Winners (Since '92):

92/93 Juventus
93/94 Inter Milan
94/95 Parma
95/96 Bayern Munich
96/97 Schalke 04
97/98 Inter Milan
98/99 Parma
99/00 Galatasaray
00/01 Liverpool
01/02 Feyenoord
02/03 Porto
03/04 Valencia
04/05 CSKA Moscow
05/06 Sevilla
06/07 Sevilla
07/08 Zenit St. Petersburg
08/09 Shakhtar Donetsk
09/10 Atlético Madrid
10/11 Porto

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1st Round Qualifying (2 legs - home & away):

KR Reykjavík (8) v ÍF Fuglafjørður (2)
Daugava Daugavpils (1) v Tromsø (7)
Elfsborg (5) v Fola Esch (1)
The New Saints (2) v Cliftonville (1)
Honka (2) v Nõmme Kalju (0)
Fulham (3) v NSÍ Runavík (0)
ÍBV Vestmannaeyar (1) v St Patrick's Athletic (2)
Häcken (6) v Käerjéng 97 (2)
Aalesund (6) v Neath (1)
Renova (3) v Glentoran (3-pens)
Koper (2) v Shakhter Karagandy (3)
Banga Gargždai (0) v Qarabağ (7)
Paks (5) v UE Santa Coloma (0)
Rabotnički (7) v Narva Trans (1)
Rad (9) v Tre Penne (1)
Budućnost Podgorica (3) v Flamurtari Vlorë (4)
Ulisses (0) v Ferencváros (5)
Jagiellonia Białystok (1) v Irtysh Pavlodar (2)
Minsk (3) v Olimpik-Suvalan (2)
Dinamo Tbilisi (5) v Milsami Orhei (1)
Varaždin (6) v Lusitanos (1)
Banants (1) v Olimpi Rustavi (2)
Birkirkara (1) v Vllaznia Shkodër (2)
Široki Brijeg (0) v Olimpija Ljubljana (3)
Spartak Trnava (4) v Zeta (2)

2nd Round Qualifying (2 legs - home & away):

Olimpi Rustavi (3) v Irtysh Pavlodar (1)
Sūduva Marijampolė (1) v Elfsborg (4)
Metalurg Skopje (2) v Lokomotiv Sofia (3)
Sant Julià (0) v Bnei Yehuda (4)
Željezničar (1) v Sheriff Tiraspol (0)
KuPS (1) v Gaz Metan Mediaş (2)
Minsk (2) v Gaziantepspor (5)
Iskra-Stal (2) v Varaždin (4)
Tauras Tauragė (2) v ADO Den Haag (5)
Glentoran (0) v Vorskla Poltava (5)
Juvenes/Dogana (0) v Rabotnički (4)
Örebro (0) v Sarajevo (2)
Crusaders (1) v Fulham (7)
Llanelli (2) v Dinamo Tbilisi (6)
Floriana (0) v AEK Larnaca (9)
Shakhtsyor Salihorsk (2) v Ventspils (4)
Flamurtari Vlorë (1) v Jablonec (7)
KR Reykjavík (3) v Žilina (2)
Mika (0) v Vålerenga (2)
Olimpija Ljubljana (3) v Bohemians (1)
Domžale (2) v Split (5)
Differdange 03 (1) v Levadia Tallinn (0)
Tirana (1) v Spartak Trnava (3)
Ferencváros (3) v Aalesund (4)
Liepājas Metalurgs (1) v Red Bull Salzburg (4)
Rad (1) v Olympiakos Volou (2)
The New Saints (3) v Midtjylland (8)
Kecskemét (1) v Aktobe (1 - away goals)
Häcken (3) v Honka (0)
Gagra (2) v Anorthosis (3)
Vaduz (3 - away goals) v Vojvodina (3)
Rudar (0) v Austria Wien (5)
Śląsk Wrocław (3 - away goals) v Dundee United (3)
Shakhter Karagandy (2) v St Patrick's Athletic (3)
EB/Streymur (1) v Qarabağ (1 - away goals)
FH (1) v Nacional (3)
Paks (4) v Tromsø (1)
TPS (0) v Westerlo (1)
Khazar Lankaran (1) v Maccabi Tel Aviv (3)
Vllaznia Shkodër (1) v Thun (2)

3rd Round Qualifying (2 legs - home & away):
1st Leg - 28th July | 2nd Leg - 4th August

Atlético Madrid v Strømsgodset
Young Boys v Westerlo
Ventspils v Red Star Belgrade
Alania Vladikavkaz v Aktobe
AEK Larnaca v Mladá Boleslav
Željezničar v Maccabi Tel Aviv
AZ Alkmaar v Jablonec
Olimpija Ljubljana v Austria Wien
Bursaspor v Gomel
Aalesund v Elfsborg
Gaziantepspor v Legia Warsaw
Hapoel Tel Aviv v Vaduz
Metalurgist Rustavi v Rennes
Levski Sofia v Spartak Trnava
Midtjylland v Vitória Guimarães
Dinamo Bucureşti v Varaždin
Karpaty Lviv v St Patrick's Athletic
Palermo v Thun
KR Reykjavík v Dinamo Tbilisi
Omonia v ADO Den Haag
Red Bull Salzburg v Senica
Club Brugge v Qarabağ
Differdange 03 v Olympiakos Volou
Mainz 05 v Gaz Metan Mediaş
Bnei Yehuda v Helsingborg
Stoke City v Hajduk Split
Anorthosis v Rabotnički
Sparta Prague v Sarajevo
Vorskla Poltava v Sligo Rovers
Paks v Heart of Midlothian
Śląsk Wrocław v Lokomotiv Sofia
Nacional v Häcken
Ried v Brøndby
Vålerenga v PAOK
Split v Fulham
kurtsimonw
People can say what they want about this competition, the recent winners have all been quality sides.
Zed.D
Is that supposed to be ironic?
Fillipo Simone
So...any predictions?
kurtsimonw
I would say Roma.. but then they will probably not take it seriously.
Danny
One of the CL drop outs. Whoever that will be.
Milan Are Brilliant
QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Jun 17 2011, 06:33 PM) *
I would say Roma.. but then they will probably not take it seriously.

I thought them too to be honest.
Kazdoodle
Might go for tottenham to win this one. dont know why. but i feel it some reason
Dill.B
With Leonardo, Ancelotti & 3-4 new players, PSG can go for it.
Fillipo Simone
You think Ancelotti will go for it? I'm all excited about PSG's new air, but still...
Jack Bauer
I'll go with Kiev and Sheva - I'll follow him closely, like always, till he retires.
Milan Are Brilliant
QUOTE (Jack Bauer @ Jun 19 2011, 05:51 AM) *
I'll go with Kiev and Sheva - I'll follow him closely, like always, till he retires.

I'd love that to happen, isn't next season his last? unsure.gif
X-Offender
QUOTE (Milan Are Brilliant @ Jun 19 2011, 01:05 PM) *
I'd love that to happen, isn't next season his last? unsure.gif


Yep. sad.gif
Kazdoodle
Shame sad.gif. love sheva i do

yeah hopefully he ends it with a cup
kurtsimonw
small heath to play Nacional of Portugal. Shame, I was hoping they'd be drawn against an Eastern team since they probably wouldn't be able to afford to travel that far.
Jack Bauer
Thun eliminated Palermo on away goals yesterday. Another Italian team humiliated in Europa League dry.gif
X-Offender
QUOTE (Jack Bauer @ Aug 5 2011, 06:03 PM) *
Thun eliminated Palermo on away goals yesterday. Another Italian team humiliated in Europa League dry.gif


Before it's even started.
Fillipo Simone
It's really a sad thing...
acid911
Thun, huh? sleep.gif Is that even a club, first time I heard of it. Sad, yes, but I'm afraid the worst is yet to come. Unless the Italian clubs learn to not only work together (selling star players to foreign teams is good for $$$, bad for the league), but also get their act together and take Europe seriously. Very seriously.
Danny
Rangers (one of the CL dropouts) got NK Maribor. A nice 'glamorous' trip to Slovenia.

Ahhh, the bowels of European football. For teams like Fulham, Stoke and Brum to be in this is just ludicrous. No wonder it's such an abysmal competition.

Watching the draw was depressing. Team after team I'd literally never heard of.
Milan Are Brilliant
QUOTE (Danny @ Aug 6 2011, 06:01 PM) *
Watching the draw was depressing. Team after team I'd literally never heard of.

Welcome to the reality of flopping in the CL qualifying rounds.
Danny
QUOTE (Milan Are Brilliant @ Aug 6 2011, 06:06 PM) *
Welcome to the reality of flopping in the CL qualifying rounds.


I suppose it beats what happened against Kaunas a few years ago where we ended up out of Europe entirely.

Europa is piss poor but it's better than nothing.

I saw an SSN report on the financial gulf between it and the CL.

EL = group stage = 1.5M
CL = group stage = 15M

EL win = 200k
CL win = 750k

EL draw = 60k
CL draw = 250k

Failing to make the group stage can financially hurt a team BIG time.
kurtsimonw
QUOTE (Danny @ Aug 6 2011, 06:13 PM) *
Failing to make the group stage can financially hurt a team BIG time.

Let's hope Nacional get the job done then!
Danny
QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Aug 6 2011, 10:17 PM) *
Let's hope Nacional get the job done then!


You slightly misunderstand. I meant the CL group stage. The pennies on offer in the EL are just that. Failure to make the EL group stage isn't a massive loss of revenue. But failure to make the CL group stage can cost a club up to £20M.
kurtsimonw
Ah, I see. Oh well, let's hope they have to go to Eastern Europe at least to F them up even more.
il_diavolo_mtl
QUOTE (Danny @ Aug 6 2011, 01:01 PM) *
Rangers (one of the CL dropouts) got NK Maribor. A nice 'glamorous' trip to Slovenia.

Ahhh, the bowels of European football.

Sweet...xenophobia...

Justify a country from the so-called "bowels" of Europe is ranked 39 spots higher on Fifa's rankings then your scotland with +/- 1/3 of it's population.

The EL is constantly discredited as a boring competition but smaller-country teams beat out european giants every year and it's really exciting for those teams' fan-base. I follow Maribor a bit and they are a really young team with alot of potential. I know from your end of the draw, it seems like a useless match, but for people like my cousin(avid Maribor fan) it's as big a match as he may see all year.


QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Aug 6 2011, 09:39 PM) *
Ah, I see. Oh well, let's hope they have to go to Eastern Europe at least to F them up even more.

Last time SVN played ENG played i think you only won 2-1 because of a sickening dive by Rooney and the other goal was a deflected shot...

I hate being "that guy" but i do feel that my country is taking a needless beating here...
kurtsimonw
QUOTE (il_diavolo_mtl @ Aug 7 2011, 02:46 AM) *
Last time SVN played ENG played i think you only won 2-1 because of a sickening dive by Rooney and the other goal was a deflected shot...

I hate being "that guy" but i do feel that my country is taking a needless beating here...

What? I'm not sure why you're taking this negatively. If anything it's because I want them to travel a long distance and lose. I fail to see how this is mocking Eastern European teams.

Anyways, didn't we play at WC2010?
il_diavolo_mtl
QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Aug 6 2011, 10:24 PM) *
What? I'm not sure why you're taking this negatively. If anything it's because I want them to travel a long distance and lose. I fail to see how this is mocking Eastern European teams.

Anyways, didn't we play at WC2010?

I realize i said i wrote last time and not one of the last times... sorry about the misspeak
Ok because i read
QUOTE
Ah, I see. Oh well, let's hope they have to go to Eastern Europe at least to F (*)them up even more.

I assumed by the construction of sentance you were hoping they (rangers) would **** up Maribor *more*(?!). Meaning there were already ****** up and since no argument was presented, i assumed you saying more meant you already assumed they were ****** up.

I guess context is lost in writing, I apologize if i misread it...
Fillipo Simone
rolleyes.gif nasty words...
kurtsimonw
QUOTE (il_diavolo_mtl @ Aug 7 2011, 04:35 AM) *
I realize i said i wrote last time and not one of the last times... sorry about the misspeak
Ok because i read

I assumed by the construction of sentance you were hoping they (rangers) would **** up Maribor *more*(?!). Meaning there were already ****** up and since no argument was presented, i assumed you saying more meant you already assumed they were ****** up.

I guess context is lost in writing, I apologize if i misread it...

I wasn't talking about Rangers. I am hoping Birmingham have to go to Eastern Europe (added cost, worse lag and colder temperatures) which would F them up.
Danny
QUOTE (il_diavolo_mtl @ Aug 7 2011, 02:46 AM) *
Sweet...xenophobia...

Justify a country from the so-called "bowels" of Europe is ranked 39 spots higher on Fifa's rankings then your scotland with +/- 1/3 of it's population.

The EL is constantly discredited as a boring competition but smaller-country teams beat out european giants every year and it's really exciting for those teams' fan-base. I follow Maribor a bit and they are a really young team with alot of potential. I know from your end of the draw, it seems like a useless match, but for people like my cousin(avid Maribor fan) it's as big a match as he may see all year.


1: I am not insulting Slovenia at all - there is no xenophobia whatsoever.

2: The fact Hearts (from Scotland) are in this tournament, along with Stoke, Fulham and Birmingham (England) not to mention Thun (Switzerland) and Shamrock Rovers (Ireland) are why this is the bowels of European competition. It's a sham of a tournament who let almost anyone in. How Fulham can be in this on 'fair play' is beyond me.

3: I'm overjoyed for your cousin who can enjoy playing against a reasonably well known European club in Rangers. But it doesn't disguise the complete lack of quality of the majority of teams in it.

So, m'boy, don't be so defensive. I'm insulting the tournament, not Slovenia. There are just way too many unheard of rubbish teams in this.
Danny
QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Aug 7 2011, 11:22 AM) *
I wasn't talking about Rangers. I am hoping Birmingham have to go to Eastern Europe (added cost, worse lag and colder temperatures) which would F them up.


Don't technically Rangers have to go to the Baltic nations too? That's where Slovenia is, right?
Fillipo Simone
QUOTE (Danny @ Aug 7 2011, 05:51 PM) *
Don't technically Rangers have to go to the Baltic nations too? That's where Slovenia is, right?

Nope, not even remotely close wink.gif

Danny
I must book a trip to the Czech Repulbic sometime soon laugh.gif
Milan Are Brilliant
Tottenham are actually making a mockery of Hearts, I'd honestly expect Torquay to be better than this against the same side. They don't deserve to be in Europe if they are actually this bad.
Jack Bauer
Schalke lost 2-0 in Finland to HJK Helsinki.
Milan Are Brilliant
Tottenham winning 5-0 away now, shambles.
kurtsimonw
Hearts would struggle to stay in the Football League down here, that was just embarassing. There's certainly some League 2 sides as good as them.
Milan Are Brilliant
QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Aug 19 2011, 02:02 AM) *
Hearts would struggle to stay in the Football League down here, that was just embarassing. There's certainly some League 2 sides as good as them.

I'm sure of it, and Celtic drew at home to FC Sion, Rangers lost to NK Maribor ('in the bowels of Europe') not the best advert for the Scottish League.
Danny
QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Aug 19 2011, 02:02 AM) *
Hearts would struggle to stay in the Football League down here, that was just embarassing. There's certainly some League 2 sides as good as them.


Outwith the OF the SPL is somewhere between League 1 and lower Championship. I wouldn't pretend for a second that Dundee Utd, Hearts, Motherwell etc are anything other than completely poor.
Danny
QUOTE (Milan Are Brilliant @ Aug 19 2011, 09:05 AM) *
I'm sure of it, and Celtic drew at home to FC Sion, Rangers lost to NK Maribor ('in the bowels of Europe') not the best advert for the Scottish League.


It wasn't, but then again the national team beat Denmark a couple of weeks ago.

Meh, I'm not kidding anyone, the level of Scottish football is dire. Rangers and Celtic have potential to be much better - but they need out of the SPL.
Milan Are Brilliant
QUOTE (Danny @ Aug 19 2011, 02:25 PM) *
Meh, I'm not kidding anyone, the level of Scottish football is dire. Rangers and Celtic have potential to be much better - but they need out of the SPL.

Yeah if you joined another league, the obvious being the EPL then you would have more allure. But I'm like a lot of people on this matter, if you want to join you take the same route as everyone else, in starting from the bottom and working your way to the Prem. Which feasibly wouldn't work for clubs your size, so I just don't see what can be done about it.
kurtsimonw
I think if Rangers and Celtic made the switch the EPL they would do quite well. I don't think much of either squad right now, but you have to take into account they'd be making £30m+ a year more than they do now with the EPL tv money.
il_diavolo_mtl
QUOTE (Milan Are Brilliant @ Aug 19 2011, 04:05 AM) *
I'm sure of it, and Celtic drew at home to FC Sion, Rangers lost to NK Maribor ('in the bowels of Europe') not the best advert for the Scottish League.

My cousin is still cheering tongue.gif

Also Roma lose and Lazio destroyed 6-0 with Cisse/Klose combining for 3 goals.
Danny
QUOTE (Milan Are Brilliant @ Aug 19 2011, 02:38 PM) *
Yeah if you joined another league, the obvious being the EPL then you would have more allure. But I'm like a lot of people on this matter, if you want to join you take the same route as everyone else, in starting from the bottom and working your way to the Prem. Which feasibly wouldn't work for clubs your size, so I just don't see what can be done about it.


I don't disagree, I think we should start at the bottom. We wouldn't cope in the EPL in our current state.
Danny
QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Aug 19 2011, 02:57 PM) *
I think if Rangers and Celtic made the switch the EPL they would do quite well. I don't think much of either squad right now, but you have to take into account they'd be making £30m+ a year more than they do now with the EPL tv money.


Newcastle got relegated on that money. Leeds collapsed years ago. Big teams have failed in the EPL and its riches.

If the OF went to England, it would be much safer to build up to the EPL by starting maybe at League 2 and then get themselves healthily into the EPL.

But it would be years before either broke the top 10.
Milan Are Brilliant
QUOTE (Danny @ Aug 19 2011, 04:01 PM) *
Newcastle got relegated on that money. Leeds collapsed years ago. Big teams have failed in the EPL and its riches.

If the OF went to England, it would be much safer to build up to the EPL by starting maybe at League 2 and then get themselves healthily into the EPL.

But it would be years before either broke the top 10.

Leeds collapsed because of Ridsdale to be fair. They spent copious amounts of money and never actually won anything, they easily had the best team on paper at the start of the last decade and still won nothing.

League 2 isn't the bottom, that's a bit of an issue as there's still non-league sides etc. The issue I see is how would you support yourselves on that? I mean are you telling me that a - there won't be fallout from them joining the ENGLISH league (come on, we know there will be) and b - they are going to come close to selling out a ground when they are playing Aldershot, Wycombe & Torquay? So how would you cover costs of the ground, etc. And say goodbye to 99% of your players. It's a tough one really, it would take some planning to say the least.
Danny
QUOTE (Milan Are Brilliant @ Aug 19 2011, 04:07 PM) *
Leeds collapsed because of Ridsdale to be fair. They spent copious amounts of money and never actually won anything, they easily had the best team on paper at the start of the last decade and still won nothing.


They spent the same as Rangers did - about 70M. Rangers survived. Only just, mind you.

QUOTE
League 2 isn't the bottom, that's a bit of an issue as there's still non-league sides etc. The issue I see is how would you support yourselves on that? I mean are you telling me that a - there won't be fallout from them joining the ENGLISH league (come on, we know there will be) and b - they are going to come close to selling out a ground when they are playing Aldershot, Wycombe & Torquay? So how would you cover costs of the ground, etc. And say goodbye to 99% of your players. It's a tough one really, it would take some planning to say the least.


Put it this way, Spurs turnover is about 150m. Our equivalent, Hearts, have a turnover of £8M.

What is the turnover of clubs in the lower leagues?
Milan Are Brilliant
QUOTE (Danny @ Aug 20 2011, 12:18 PM) *
They spent the same as Rangers did - about 70M. Rangers survived. Only just, mind you.

Put it this way, Spurs turnover is about 150m. Our equivalent, Hearts, have a turnover of £8M.

What is the turnover of clubs in the lower leagues?

Well Ridsdale spent money they didn't have on the basis they'd qualify for the CL year in, year out, which they didn't.

It's not in the millions in League 2. There are big spenders like Crawley, but they are financed by rich owners not their turnover.
Danny
QUOTE (Milan Are Brilliant @ Aug 20 2011, 02:46 PM) *
Well Ridsdale spent money they didn't have on the basis they'd qualify for the CL year in, year out, which they didn't.


Murray did the same. He spent money we didn't have, chasing a dream. Funnily enough we didn't finally qualify for the last 16 of the CL till we were pretty broke and had a mediocre team!

QUOTE
It's not in the millions in League 2. There are big spenders like Crawley, but they are financed by rich owners not their turnover.


I suppose in many ways I'd rather not end up in the lower leagues. Don't want to end up like Juventus. But I don't just expect us to be let in at even Championship level.
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