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Bluesummers
What do you guys think?


Should we sell Gattuso? Should we try to work with him and see if we can find a solution? If we can't find a common solution do you think Leo should change his ways to include gattuso?



Zed.D
It's his choice. Leo is chosen as the coach and apparently he doesn't believe in 2 DMs. so, either Gattuso accepts this and fights for a place with Ambro and Flamini or he leaves. needless to say I hope he stays but not at the cost of going back to playing 2DMs system, if only that will make him stay. I don't think Leo should change the team's playing system [now that it's finally working] to keep individuals happy. I always believed/said while Rino and Ambro are both good players, they shouldn't be both playing at the same and I'm glad the coach seems to think the same thing.

I have to admit something, if it came to choosing between Rino and Ambro, I'd go for Ambro. he thrives in this new system. finally he plays the role he's made for, no more useless "Ambro ahead of Dinho as the left wing" thing Carlo invented.
Tennie
In terms of coach's choice - it's up to who plays best. Gattuso has been struggling with injury much of the season so it's a little hard to judge. I'm going to hold off on saying sell or not until he's fully fit and has had a chance to play. The only guy I'd start every single game no matter what is Nesta (and possibly Pato). Everyone else needs to show they deserve to start.

In terms of the way the club (apart from Leonardo's lineup choices) has been treating Gattuso (and how they treat Pippo and how they treated Maldini)...a major fins down from Fishdoll. THIS is what bothers me and what I really, really dislike.
kurtsimonw
I'd say sell him if it's true that he's unhappy with his lack of playing time. He's been suspended or injured for most the season so can't exactly have expected to play. If this is his attitude and he feels like he s hould be guaranteed a first team spot. Goodbye.
dst
Yeah... goobye Gattuso, goobye! tongue.gif

QUOTE (Tennie @ Nov 28 2009, 01:49 PM) *
In terms of the way the club (apart from Leonardo's lineup choices) has been treating Gattuso (and how they treat Pippo and how they treated Maldini)...a major fins down from Fishdoll. THIS is what bothers me and what I really, really dislike.

Are you referring to Maldini's contract extension issue? And what has happened with Inzaghi and Gattuso?
Patinho
he should finish his career at rangers tongue.gif
Tennie
Nah, dst, I'm referring to the lack of any response from club management after the disgraceful behavior of the curva at Maldini's farewell game. And the fact that management are basically, it seems, willing to jettison both Pippo and Rino at the moment. Technical choices are one thing - and I don't have a problem if the coach thinks player x will be better in the tactical formation than player y - but the way the club treats players is just not cool and that's what has me rather upset. The Maldini thing was just the most noticeable beginning to the pattern.
han2503
I agree with Tennie.

I also think Ambro is the best guy for the current system. I haven't seen this Ambro in years, since before Carlo came and put Pirlo in the DM position.

I don't know how Gattuso would fair playing this new system, he hasn't really had the chance because of all the injuries. But I believe that once he's fit he'll put Ambro to the sward. It's a long season, we've seen what happened to Pirlo and Ambro they're burned out because of all the games, the midfield needs to be rotated. I'm sure both Rino and Flamini will get more then enough playing time.
dst
QUOTE (Tennie @ Nov 28 2009, 06:12 PM) *
Nah, dst, I'm referring to the lack of any response from club management after the disgraceful behavior of the curva at Maldini's farewell game.

Yeah, I remember that! dry.gif

QUOTE (Tennie @ Nov 28 2009, 06:12 PM) *
And the fact that management are basically, it seems, willing to jettison both Pippo and Rino at the moment.

Where do you get that feeling from? unsure.gif
Tennie
Well, the way the club blithely denied there was any problem with Rino up to the day that Rino himself gave the interview is one pretty obvious clue -- again, I wish I could provide links but this comes from watching the sky sport italia 24 hour news program every day for over a week -- and the same 'there's no problem with pippo' after he made an appearance on a talk show and commented very diplomatically that he'd love to have more playing time and to extend his contract. The only direct response to anything he said was Galliani commenting that he'd discuss contract renewals in the spring.
I_Rossoneri
QUOTE (Zed.D @ Nov 28 2009, 11:48 AM) *
It's his choice. Leo is chosen as the coach and apparently he doesn't believe in 2 DMs. so, either Gattuso accepts this and fights for a place with Ambro and Flamini or he leaves. needless to say I hope he stays but not at the cost of going back to playing 2DMs system, if only that will make him stay. I don't think Leo should change the team's playing system [now that it's finally working] to keep individuals happy. I always believed/said while Rino and Ambro are both good players, they shouldn't be both playing at the same and I'm glad the coach seems to think the same thing.

I have to admit something, if it came to choosing between Rino and Ambro, I'd go for Ambro. he thrives in this new system. finally he plays the role he's made for, no more useless "Ambro ahead of Dinho as the left wing" thing Carlo invented.



QUOTE (Tennie @ Nov 28 2009, 11:49 AM) *
In terms of coach's choice - it's up to who plays best. Gattuso has been struggling with injury much of the season so it's a little hard to judge. I'm going to hold off on saying sell or not until he's fully fit and has had a chance to play. The only guy I'd start every single game no matter what is Nesta (and possibly Pato). Everyone else needs to show they deserve to start.

In terms of the way the club (apart from Leonardo's lineup choices) has been treating Gattuso (and how they treat Pippo and how they treated Maldini)...a major fins down from Fishdoll. THIS is what bothers me and what I really, really dislike.


Agree with both the above posts, I'd also agree with what Kurt says in that if he going to start whingeing about not being picked then perhaps he should go. I find gattuso's apparent attitude quite disrespectful to the other players, every player should be played on merit and not because they whine or are a big name player. If he's that unhappy then try harder in training and wait for a place, or just go quietly.
I_Rossoneri
QUOTE (Tennie @ Nov 28 2009, 06:09 PM) *
Well, the way the club blithely denied there was any problem with Rino up to the day that Rino himself gave the interview is one pretty obvious clue -- again, I wish I could provide links but this comes from watching the sky sport italia 24 hour news program every day for over a week -- and the same 'there's no problem with pippo' after he made an appearance on a talk show and commented very diplomatically that he'd love to have more playing time and to extend his contract. The only direct response to anything he said was Galliani commenting that he'd discuss contract renewals in the spring.


Pippo obviously realises how a proffessional football player should act, hopefully he will get a contract extension albeit for a year.
Danny
My biggest concern with Rino is he describes himself as indispensible. That he cannot handle the notion that he isn't.

I'm fond of him, but any player who says that about themselves considers themselves as bigger than the rest. None of our players are indispensible, and those who are, sure aren't stupid or egotistical enough to say it.
han2503
I'm finding all this Rino talk hard to believe. I really think this is a case of the media blowing things way out of proportion
Bluesummers
no one on our squad is good enough to be indespensible. In the last 3 years the only player was kaka, and he was sold.
Bluesummers
QUOTE
Chelsea manager Carlo Ancelotti has insisted he does not expect Milan midfielder Gennaro Gattuso to follow him to Stamford Bridge in January.

Rumours are circulating suggesting the Italian international could be set to make a move to the Premier League in the New Year, most likely with his former Milan coach.

However, the Blues boss has offered little weight to the story, maintaining his expectancy of Gattuso to stay with the Rossoneri at least for the time being.

"Rino is a Milan player," said Ancelotti, according to the Daily Mirror.

"I had a good relationship with him, but I don't think he'll be coming here."

Chelsea were facing a transfer embargo for the next two transfer windows following their improper handling of the signing of youngster Gael Kakuta, but the ban has now been suspended.

Ancelotti currently has a wealth of midfield options at his disposal though, including Michael Essien, Jon Obi Mikel, Michael Ballack and Frank Lampard, amongst others.

Jamie Dunn, Goal.com UK
Bluesummers
QUOTE
AC Milan Vice-President Adriano Galliani Lining Up Potential Gattuso Replacements - Report

With the meeting between Adriano Galliani and Gennaro Gattuso seemingly not resolving a great deal with regards to the midfielder’s future, it seems the Rossoneri are studying their options as they look to avoid being caught short should ‘Ringhio’ decide to leave this winter.

According to Sportsmediaset, Milan have identified Fabio Simplicio, McDonald Mariga and Cristian Ledesma – as potential replacements for their midfield hard man.

Given the trio all occupy different roles in the midfield line; it is believed Parma’s Mariga is in pole position given his similar characteristics to the Italian World Cup winner.

However, since coach Leonardo already has Mathieu Flamini and Massimo Ambrosini covering the defence midfielder role; it could be likely that the Brazilian will search for an understudy to Andrea Pirlo.

Stefano Federici, Goal.com


IMO, let strasser play. Why waste the money? Take the money and go spend it on a fullback.
ganney
QUOTE (Bluesummers @ Nov 28 2009, 10:44 PM) *
IMO, let strasser play. Why waste the money? Take the money and go spend it on a fullback.


the ledesma story's getting interesting as he has asked for his contract to be rescinded. i'm not at all sure strasser is ready.
Bluesummers
QUOTE (ganney @ Nov 28 2009, 03:51 PM) *
the ledesma story's getting interesting as he has asked for his contract to be rescinded. i'm not at all sure strasser is ready.

But the problem with ledesma is we've got to pay his contract which will be 60k at least. I have no problem getting him if we can afford it but realistically I think its a waste.



We play with 1 DMF, 2 AM 2 Wingers and a CF.



always its, ambro, seedorf, pirlo, dinho, pato, borriello



We have flamini and gattuso on the bench. 2 worldclass dmf who don't even play. Thats why I don't think its worth the time to spend the money on a player who'se realistically not going to play all that much.


Let ambro and flamini play the games out and bring in strasser and let him develop. If we don't give our youth a chance, there is no point having a youth system. We might as well not waste the money and just buy players at the age 18 from other clubs.



saying that, having seen strasser play live and practice; he's very talented. We have Ikande, merkel, and novjnic as well in our youth system who are very decent players.
LaPalma
I'm honestly shocked how fast people declare that Rino can go. He's one of the most respected players in Europe. Even here in Germany where Italian players are generally disliked Rino is a very respected player because of his aggresive style.
Also, he spent the best years of his career with Milan and was one of the main reasons we won the CL in 03 and 07. Selling him at the first sign of problems would be wrong.
han2503
QUOTE (LaPalma @ Nov 29 2009, 02:21 PM) *
I'm honestly shocked how fast people declare that Rino can go. He's one of the most respected players in Europe. Even here in Germany where Italian players are generally disliked Rino is a very respected player because of his aggresive style.
Also, he spent the best years of his career with Milan and was one of the main reasons we won the CL in 03 and 07. Selling him at the first sign of problems would be wrong.

+1
kurtsimonw
QUOTE (LaPalma @ Nov 29 2009, 01:21 PM) *
I'm honestly shocked how fast people declare that Rino can go. He's one of the most respected players in Europe. Even here in Germany where Italian players are generally disliked Rino is a very respected player because of his aggresive style.
Also, he spent the best years of his career with Milan and was one of the main reasons we won the CL in 03 and 07. Selling him at the first sign of problems would be wrong.

When a player who has practically spent the whole year injured and suspended cmes out and labels himself untouchable.. well, that's not who I want in my team.
amancik
The weird thing is, he's unavailable because of injury and yet he complained about not playing? ... can't he at least wait until he's fit again?
Jack Sparrow
The thing is it might be the media twisting things or putting words in his mouth.

For instance if the question was along the lines of "What happens if you're fully fit, and you're still not considered to play?" and then he made the response he did, things would be a lot less controversial.
amancik
QUOTE (Jack Sparrow @ Nov 30 2009, 03:10 AM) *
The thing is it might be the media twisting things or putting words in his mouth.

For instance if the question was along the lines of "What happens if you're fully fit, and you're still not considered to play?" and then he made the response he did, things would be a lot less controversial.


You're may be right, either way, the last thing we need is distruption in the dressing room when we're currently in decent form.
ganney
i really can't start to imagine rino in another team's colours.. he's our man, i think he just need to come off his mighty horse and realise that his present form is in serious recession and every guy in the starting line-up has earned it so he needs to buckle up and get with the programme.

milan in the latter stages of the ECL without our snarler is just unthinkable
kurtsimonw
I'm sure I'd survive.
Protagonist
QUOTE (ganney @ Nov 29 2009, 11:43 PM) *
i really can't start to imagine rino in another team's colours.. he's our man, i think he just need to come off his mighty horse and realise that his present form is in serious recession and every guy in the starting line-up has earned it so he needs to buckle up and get with the programme.

milan in the latter stages of the ECL without our snarler is just unthinkable


Although I really want Gattuso to be out there again, I think we survived Shevchenko and Kaka, I think we can survive him. Considering our position in the league, I think we can move on without him.

dst
I cannot believe he's said those things. He's not a classy player but he's a fighter. He will battle for his place before he comes out with something like that.

QUOTE (kurtsimonw @ Nov 30 2009, 12:53 AM) *
I'm sure I'd survive.

laugh.gif
Bluesummers
QUOTE
Milan Chief Adriano Galliani: I've Tried Everything To Convince Gennaro Gattuso To Stay


Milan vice president Adriano Galliani is no more certain over Gennaro Gattuso's future at the club as he waits anxiously on a decision from the player.

Gattuso has been linked with an exit after findng limited chances under Leonardo's new tactical system. Local media in Milan has been rife with speculation suggesting the player is ready to turn his back on the club as relations became strained further.

However, Galliani has stepped in to raze the rumours, but his comments leave a hint of uncertainty.

"I have used all the methods possible to convince Gattuso, now we have to wait and see what happens," Galliani told Sky Sport Italia.

The club premier was then quick to move on from the awkward questions as he turned his attention to pitch matters. Galliani has lauded Klaas-Jan Huntelaar for his double strike against Catania, but has reminded the faithful not to compare him with the legendary Marco van Basten.

"Klaas scored a brilliant goal, but we must not compare him with van Basten," concluded the chief.

Salvatore Landolina, Goal.com
MizNelson
QUOTE (Protagonist @ Nov 29 2009, 03:10 PM) *
Although I really want Gattuso to be out there again, I think we survived Shevchenko and Kaka, I think we can survive him. Considering our position in the league, I think we can move on without him.

Agreed. He's been injured nearly all season and we're playing well without him, which makes the timing of his comments not so smart.
somedevil
sell gattuso buy zuculini !
servbot
I think Milan will be OK without him, but I would love to see him stick around, and reclaim some of his old form. I haven't seen him play for Milan in his prime, but Gattuso being on Milan was one of the things that attracted me to this club. I loved watching him in the 06 World Cup.

Sell Flamini instead, imo. Let Gattuso be our crazy midfielder.
Suhail 3
QUOTE (servbot @ Dec 1 2009, 10:01 PM) *
I think Milan will be OK without him, but I would love to see him stick around, and reclaim some of his old form. I haven't seen him play for Milan in his prime, but Gattuso being on Milan was one of the things that attracted me to this club. I loved watching him in the 06 World Cup.

Sell Flamini instead, imo. Let Gattuso be our crazy midfielder.

why on earth should we sell flamini - one of the greatest steals of last season hes 24-25 gattuso has lost his touch and judging on those comments the plot too if any DM is to be sold its gattuso not even ambro - sorry i dont really treat players like royalty if there perfoming great and happy if there not even playing and are moaning about leaving then let them
Bluesummers
selling gattuso? We will be selling an italian international, a legend of the country and the club and a potential future staff member.

His replacment won't be any of those, it'll probably be a washed up gago.
MizNelson
QUOTE (Bluesummers @ Dec 2 2009, 01:17 PM) *
selling gattuso? We will be selling an italian international, a legend of the country and the club and a potential future staff member.

Neither of these are relevant if he's injured for a good portion of the season and doesn't have much left in the tank.
Bluesummers
QUOTE (MizNelson @ Dec 3 2009, 01:09 AM) *
Neither of these are relevant if he's injured for a good portion of the season and doesn't have much left in the tank.

yeah but its not just selling a player. Were not selling a mercenary here. Were selling a club icon. Its like selling Kaka; selling gattuso is just not right, especially not over something silly like playing time, which can be given easily.
dst
You do sell a club icon when he's not behaving like one... if Gattuso wants to be played just because he's been here all these years and not because he deserves to then we should show him the door.

He should be willing to fight for his place.
Danny
QUOTE (dst @ Dec 3 2009, 10:42 AM) *
You do sell a club icon when he's not behaving like one... if Gattuso wants to be played just because he's been here all these years and not because he deserves to then we should show him the door.

He should be willing to fight for his place.


Indeed. I don't ever recall a single comment of this nature during Maldini's last few seasons here - had regular injuries but when fit was often left out altogether, and not a word of complaint was ever heard. Or anything about being indispensible.

A truly dignified pro was Paolo, gracious till the end, even if I felt his 2 or 3 u-turns over retirement were highly misguided.

And he was here a bit longer than Gattuso...

Danny
QUOTE (Bluesummers @ Dec 3 2009, 08:56 AM) *
yeah but its not just selling a player. Were not selling a mercenary here. Were selling a club icon. Its like selling Kaka; selling gattuso is just not right, especially not over something silly like playing time, which can be given easily.


Whether I agreed or not, Kaka was regarded as our most important player and our best one, who the team didn't function in the absence of. Gattuso's absence, however, clearly hasn't affected us, especially in the last 2 or 3 months since it's started to click.

You can't easily give playing time either - if your first 11 is doing the business, how do you accommodate one player's ego just because he demands to play? You risk upsetting the balance you've painstaking created.

Lastly, there's no 'not right' about it - the guy is on vast wages - earns more a week than most of us in 3 years. To come out and let his opinion of his importance overide the health of the team is in no way worthy of being condoned.

And remember I have a particular affinity with Gattuso, having met him many years ago in his Rangers days, who I support as you all know, and then he's gone to my other club.

So my opinion is despite my bias towards him.
Zed.D
The question is, has Rino really said these things? did he mean what we're basing our judgments on?
Tennie
Yeah, he really said them. they replayed the interview a zillion times the last two days I was in Italy.

At first, I was full of outrage for the way the club's been treating the senior guys (starting with Maldini but including Pippo and Rino) but y'know, the more I think about it, the more I admire what Pippo's done -- stated calmly that he's at the coach's disposition and would always be happy to play -- rather than Rino going out and griping to the press. I'm tempted to think Rino's throwing his toys out of the pram now that he's not a 100% guaranteed starter. And that's not cool.
Danny
QUOTE (Zed.D @ Dec 3 2009, 02:54 PM) *
The question is, has Rino really said these things? did he mean what we're basing our judgments on?


Well he has had plenty of time to clarify what he meant, but hasn't done so. Which means what we think he meant in the first place is pretty much what he meant.
han2503
Tennie can you give us his exact quotes please?
Tennie
Here's the text of the Mediaset article about it.

QUOTE
Rino Gattuso non riesce più a mordere il freno e scuote l'ambiente del Milan dichiarando apertamente tutto il suo scontento per la prolungata assenza dal campo, dovuta non solo al recente infortunio alla coscia. "Non sono l'ultimo arrivato - è sbottato "Ringhio"- quando sto bene voglio giocare, non posso aspettare che per farlo si infortuni qualcun altro. Non sono contento, così non va. Parlerò con Galliani e vedremo quali decisioni prendere".




Un'esternazione senza giri di parole, diretta, sincera, come nello stile dell'uomo Rino Gattuso, simbolo e capitano "in pectore" di una squadra che vede andare avanti anche senza di lui. "Non riesco a pensare di non essere più indispensabile per questa squadra - confessa - Ho parlato con Leonardo e mi ha spiegato le sue scelte, ho grande rispetto per lui. Non ho problemi con i miei compagni e tra l'altro Pirlo e Ambrosini stanno giocando benissimo. Ma io devo confrontarmi con il mio stato d'animo e ci devo convivere. Mi sento ancora forte e mi spiace non poterlo dimostrare. Il problema è che questo modulo con cui gioca il Milan certamente mi penalizza, così come mi ha penalizzato l'infortunio alla coscia che mi ha messo fuori. Fino a quando non rientro, le chiacchiere se le porta il vento. Però Non posso aspettare che qualcuno dei miei compagni si faccia male per giocare io dopo 11 anni di Milan. Non sono l'ultimo arrivato"

Una foga di sentirsi ancora muro maestro del Milan che, secondo Gattuso, non dipende anche dal timore di perdere la maglia azzurra. "Questo mio stato d'animo non dipende dai mondiali -assicura il centrocampista- ne ho sentite di cotte e di crude, ma il ct mi ha assicurato che mi portera' anche se dovessi giocare poco".

Lo sfogo rinfocolerà certamente le voci su un futuro ormai prossimo di un Gattuso lontano da Milanello. "Andarmene? Non lo so, vediamo, sicuramente devo parlare con la società. Quando? Credo che la pausa di fine anno possa essere un buon momento per fare il punto e chiarirci". Proprio alla vigilia della riapertura delle liste, quindi. E con Ancelotti pronto a ricevere una telefonata speciale: "Con Carlo ci sentiamo, ma per motivi personali. Non abbiamo mai parlato di questa eventualità", ha voluto chiarire Gattuso, la cui priorità rimane il Milan, "che è la mia casa". Da attore protagonista, però: "Ringhio" non fa la comparsa nemmeno negli spot.


Here's a link to the interview: clicky

In meetings for a while so can't do translation but there's the original for anyone else who cares to.
Jack Sparrow
I'm pretty sure the answers Rino gave were quoted correctly. I'm more bothered about the exact question...
Danny
QUOTE (Jack Sparrow @ Dec 3 2009, 04:21 PM) *
I'm pretty sure the answers Rino gave were quoted correctly. I'm more bothered about the exact question...


Perhaps, but I cannot fathom a question which would force an answer of 'I can't imagine not being more vital to this team'.

I can't think of too many occasions where a player has gone on record as stating his indispensibility to a team, including guys like Mr Ego Zlatan or his compadre C Ronaldo.

Regardless of what they think of themselves, players are almost always modest about their importance to the team, with something along the lines of 'the gaffer picks the team, and I just hope I get in'. No matter how leading the question posed to them was.
Danny
QUOTE (Tennie @ Dec 3 2009, 03:01 PM) *
Yeah, he really said them. they replayed the interview a zillion times the last two days I was in Italy.

At first, I was full of outrage for the way the club's been treating the senior guys (starting with Maldini but including Pippo and Rino) but y'know, the more I think about it, the more I admire what Pippo's done -- stated calmly that he's at the coach's disposition and would always be happy to play -- rather than Rino going out and griping to the press. I'm tempted to think Rino's throwing his toys out of the pram now that he's not a 100% guaranteed starter. And that's not cool.


Rino is the exception, not the rule. Pippo and Paolo before him are and were consumate pros who always conducted themselves with modesty. Even the greatest players tend to be modest.

Rino barking out like this is bizarre - there is no doubt we'd rather he wanted to play than he was happy to take the money and sit on the bench, but complaining publicly about it while ironically accepting the guys currently playing are doing a great job seems illogical and very childish.

He says he doesn't want to wait for someone to get injured before he gets a chance to play, but just which player does he think out of Pirlo, Seedorf and Ambro deserves to be dropped in favour of him?
Bluesummers
QUOTE
Gennaro Gattuso Offered New Milan Deal

Milan chief executive officer Adriano Galliani has insisted the Serie A giants have no intention of releasing want-away Gennaro Gattuso in January and they plan to tie the midfielder to a new long-term contract to see out his playing days at the San Siro.

“Not only did I propose Gattuso to stay, but also to extend and spread out his contract and end his career at Milan,” Galliani confessed to Sky Sport 24 last night.


Gattuso is currently nursing an injury, but threatened to quit the club last week after finding his first team opportunities limited this term following the appointment of Brazilian boss Leonardo over the summer.

But Galliani is adamant there is still some wiggle room to persuade the Italy international to change his mind.

“We have an agreement: Gattuso will heal first and then we’ll meet to discuss it,” he concluded.


Vince Masiello, Goal.com


now I want gattuso to stay, but this is retarted. Were going to pay him more now sigh....
samira
gattouso is not full fit but hes still good, but if he gets sold, where whould he
coz I heard Pirlo was going to Chealsa but he did'nt unsure.gif
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