[Ry4n]

It still looks ball to hand, I don't think he moved his hand to block it but when your hand is out that far and comes in contact with the ball you definitely risk giving one away, and I have seen them given before. Did Maicon intentionally move his hand to block it, I don't think so, if he did we should sign him as a back-up GK, did you see how quick that shot was travelling?!

i think it was a penalty we've seen penalties given for less plus you just have to look at every inter player in view around maicon and see there reactions they knew it was a blatant penalty there hearts sunk for a second or two until the ref blew and i dont think they would of really had a excuse to run over to the ref to tell him it wasnt because it was but i guess the referee made up for it at the end with Cassano's penalty (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

This post has been edited by Ry4n: Apr 4 2011, 04:01 PM

[Milan Are Brilli...]

It's in the I've seen them given category, no more.

[Nova]

2-1 Both Pato patinho goals !! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/king.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/king.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/king.gif)

[vnata001]

In all honesty when we announced his signing I said on here he would surprise a few. Really liked the look of him throughout the WC.

Well, i guess ill take this opportunity to say: so did I. In fact, so many on this forum were convinced Boateng was going to be a useless signing. I, along with you and few others, thought completely otherwise.

Id also like to point out how I very adamantly asserted that Abate was improving and destined to be a fine player for us when this season started and felt strongly that Antonini and Huntelaar were very average players. This was around the same time people had nothing but hate for Abate, praise for Antonini, and thought Hunter was capable of being a top scorer in a top-flight league. I think we all can admit Abate is becoming a bright spot, while Antonini is (hopefully) on his way out, and Hunter is already gone.

Not to mention my recent full on rant about how Ibra's lack of movement hurts our midfield. Then, in our next match against quality opposition no less, Pato and Robinho's movement is a key factor in one of the best performances we have seen our midfield turn in for a looong time. I'm 100% certain that if Ibra played, our style would've been slow-to-develop long balls to his chest, and not the vertically oriented, sharp precision passing/timing/movement that we saw from our midfield and forwards. Coincidence? Ask yourself, who is the more dangerous player (not talented, dangerous): Pato or Ibra. Damn right im starting the 'were fine without Ibra campaign'.

Ahhh, vindication. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

The one thing that I will say I got wrong was Flamini and Rino. When this match started, I found myself happy that Rino was in the lineup instead of Flam. Rino has proven himself more useful over the course of this season. I think i LOVE the idea of Rino getting 60 minutes, and Flam getting 30 each and every match. Then, slowly over the course of next season, that ratio can gradually reverse.

We're winning the title back. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/devilsmiley.gif)

This post has been edited by vnata001: Apr 4 2011, 09:21 PM

[han2503]

Not to put up my flag in the Ibra camp or anything, but we've seen the team playing great football with Ibra as well. While we've seen the team play some sh!tty stuff without him. It cannot be blamed on Ibra, when the team is struggling to create they use him as a crutch, and 9 times out of 10 he's pulled us out of sh!t all by himself when we get into those situations.

Imo against Inter the big difference was that we had Seedorf and Boateng both playing in that midfield. The only weak spot in that midfield was Gattuso, compare that to a midfield of Flamini, Ambro Rino like we saw before the christmas break, imo that's asking for a stalemate and it's not a suprise that when we played that set up we ended up having to go the long ball route to Ibra becase that was the only way through.

Had that midfield been behind Pato and Robinho they wouldn't have had a look in imo, simply because they wouldn't have had the supply they did on Saturday.

Another thing, I don't agree that Rino should be starting ahead of Flamini, the midfield looked a lot better once Flamini got in there, Gattuso is a shadow of the player he used to be and with V.Bommel in there his role becomes redundent to the team

[vnata001]

Not to put up my flag in the Ibra camp or anything, but we've seen the team playing great football with Ibra as well. While we've seen the team play some sh!tty stuff without him. It cannot be blamed on Ibra, when the team is struggling to create they use him as a crutch, and 9 times out of 10 he's pulled us out of sh!t all by himself when we get into those situations.

Well i guess my point is, why were we struggling to create? quite often, Ibra just stands still asking for the ball outside of the area, and suddenly we find ourselves trying to thread balls into small iotas of space - hence, we struggle to create. IMO, its not so much a product of our sh!t midfield, but rather the lack of movement up front. could that be different with Pato up front, supported by a creative midfielder and a tricky second striker? He is faster, and 100x more willing to run into channels that create space for our midfielders. It was his willingness to run that allowed our midfield to play so expansively. Seedorf played great, but that's cuz when he got the ball he had a lot of options to pick out. When such movement from our forwards isn't there, we all know what clarence does - pass it backwards, and he's not nearly as 'creative'. IMO, we can play better 9/10 times with good movement up front, and not have to rely on an Ibra special. You can see how results turned once he stopped producing his magic, yet we still employed that same playing style.

Imo against Inter the big difference was that we had Seedorf and Boateng both playing in that midfield. The only weak spot in that midfield was Gattuso, compare that to a midfield of Flamini, Ambro Rino like we saw before the christmas break, imo that's asking for a stalemate and it's not a suprise that when we played that set up we ended up having to go the long ball route to Ibra becase that was the only way through.

Had that midfield been behind Pato and Robinho they wouldn't have had a look in imo, simply because they wouldn't have had the supply they did on Saturday.

Another thing, I don't agree that Rino should be starting ahead of Flamini, the midfield looked a lot better once Flamini got in there, Gattuso is a shadow of the player he used to be and with V.Bommel in there his role becomes redundent to the team

What team has Ibra played on where he has shown you he can play an uptempo, movement-based attacking style? At Inter, it was heave the ball to stationary Ibra. At Barca, he flopped because of his lack of movement. Its no coincidence that Inter were better off with the less natural talent but better movement that Milito supplied. Similarly, it's Villa's instinct off of the last defender that has made Barca return to their best after Ibra left.

And as far as Rino v. Flam, I think it ought to be a tactical decision. It made great sense to start with Rino's pure defensive grunt work. In the event that Inter came out clicking offensively, Rino represents less of a risk as hes just a pure defender. However, the timing of Rino's injury was perfect, because Flamini's willingness to get forward kept Inter honest at the back at times, and prevented us from sitting back — as Rino's presence likely would have done. I saw MvB as the Box to Box, Rino as the defensive glue, and Seedorf as the play maker, and Boateng as the 'i can do anything and everything' midfielder.

That said, i agree that Flam is a better all around player. From the tactical POV though, deploying Rino for the first 60 can have nice benefits. As you stated earlier in the thread, "we have flamini, cassano, and Urby from the bench". They all came on, and it worked perfectly.

I thought Boa was stunning. One second he's helping Thiago after Eto'o turns him inside out along the touchline, the next minute hes bursting through the midfield, running at the heart of the Inter backline, playing Pato through for the eventual red card. What a dynamic eff'ing player.

It must be said, IMO Allegri did nothing wrong in this match. nothing wrong.

This post has been edited by vnata001: Apr 4 2011, 10:05 PM

[Rossoneri7]

Well i guess my point is, why were we struggling to create? quite often, Ibra just stands still asking for the ball outside of the area, and suddenly we find ourselves trying to thread balls into small iotas of space - hence, we struggle to create. IMO, its not so much a product of our sh!t midfield, but rather the lack of movement up front. could that be different with Pato up front, supported by a creative midfielder and a tricky second striker? He is faster, and 100x more willing to run into channels that create space for our midfielders. It was his willingness to run that allowed our midfield to play so expansively. Seedorf played great, but that's cuz when he got the ball he had a lot of options to pick out. When such movement from our forwards isn't there, we all know what clarence does - pass it backwards, and he's not nearly as 'creative'. IMO, we can play better 9/10 times with good movement up front, and not have to rely on an Ibra special. You can see how results turned once he stopped producing his magic, yet we still employed that same playing style.



What team has Ibra played on where he has shown you he can play an uptempo, movement-based attacking style? At Inter, it was heave the ball to stationary Ibra. At Barca, he flopped because of his lack of movement. Its no coincidence that Inter were better off with the less natural talent but better movement that Milito supplied. Similarly, it's Villa's instinct off of the last defender that has made Barca return to their best after Ibra left.

And as far as Rino v. Flam, I think it ought to be a tactical decision. It made great sense to start with Rino's pure defensive grunt work. In the event that Inter came out clicking offensively, Rino represents less of a risk as hes just a pure defender. However, the timing of Rino's injury was perfect, because Flamini's willingness to get forward kept Inter honest at the back at times, and prevented us from sitting back — as Rino's presence likely would have done. I saw MvB as the Box to Box, Rino as the defensive glue, and Seedorf as the play maker, and Boateng as the 'i can do anything and everything' midfielder.

That said, i agree that Flam is a better all around player. From the tactical POV though, deploying Rino for the first 60 can have nice benefits. As you stated earlier in the thread, "we have flamini, cassano, and Urby from the bench". They all came on, and it worked perfectly.

I thought Boa was stunning. One second he's helping Thiago after Eto'o turns him inside out along the touchline, the next minute hes bursting through the midfield, running at the heart of the Inter backline, playing Pato through for the eventual red card. What a dynamic eff'ing player.

It must be said, IMO Allegri did nothing wrong in this match. nothing wrong.

Though I am of the opinion that Ibra is playing a significant role in our Scudetto run .. I agree with you in that our midfield needs fresher legs. Moreover, I believe Pato is a first team player, he must not be overlooked again. Not because of the brace that he scored, but because of his goals/minutes ratio .. He is young and scoring that frequently in a league as difficult as Serie A, he's a potential World Player of the Year candidate.

Can Pato and Ibra combine? Yes, IF Ibra takes Pato under his wings, only then will the truely prove the potential behind our attack.

[X-Offender]

Could you find a video/image of this special shot you're talking about?

(IMG:http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/7811/20010310150153067042630.jpg)

[han2503]

@vnata, you're basing you etire argument on the attackers' movement, and while I do agree that it is very important that they make runs, the midfield's movement is far more important then their's. The way V.Bommel moves, the way Boateng makes his runs, evn Rino to an extent was making a lot of movement off the ball. We've seen all of those players being static before, you can have Villa and Messi up there but if you have Rino, Amro, Flamini and Seedorf standing around pinging the ball horizontally and backwards to each other then Messi and Villa will look like cr@p I can assure you that. You think Barca's success is because of Villa and Messi's movement? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) Watch closely, their midfield is th true star of that entire simphony, no Xavi, Iniest, Busquettes behind those 3 forwards and you have an average team right there.

Also V.Bommel as box to box? No he was playing the holding mid position perfectly, him sitting in front of the defence is the reason why we've been so strong defensively lately, sure when Inter left acres of space to run into he move forward, but that is only natural

You're blaming Ibra for a lot of things, at the beginning of the season Ibra worked his @ss off constantly moving and working for the team, after xmas he hit a brick wall and it really has to be blamed on Allegri for consantly playing him even when there was no need which continued to physically plow Ibra into the ground. Pato and him, physically speaking would be the perfect pairing, they can work together great, and imo the only thing holding them back is a petty competition that is going on between the two of them.

[Milan Are Brilli...]

You think Barca's success is because of Villa and Messi's movement? Watch closely, their midfield is th true star of that entire simphony, no Xavi, Iniest, Busquettes behind those 3 forwards and you have an average team right there.

+1, I've tried saying this a million times on here before.

[Jack Sparrow]

Oh +10,000.

Might I also add that Pirlo>Xavi. The difference is in front of Pirlo there's Borriello/Huntelaar/Oliveira...a half fit Kaka and a tired Seedorf. And as a bodyguard a tiring Rino.

Xavi gets a star cast of Iniesta, Henry, Messi, Busquets, Mascherano etc.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

[han2503]

Oh +10,000.

Might I also add that Pirlo>Xavi. The difference is in front of Pirlo there's Borriello/Huntelaar/Oliveira...a half fit Kaka and a tired Seedorf. And as a bodyguard a tiring Rino.

Xavi gets a star cast of Iniesta, Henry, Messi, Busquets, Mascherano etc.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Agreed, I was going to mention Pirlo as another example. When he's had a deteriorating team with him he's looked like cr@p, why? Because Pirlo needs movement around him in order to be useful, and no just th forwards, but the FBs and mids are even more important to him. This season when he was fit and we had a full squad Pirlo was looking great again, why? Because he has Abate, Boateng, Flamini, Ibra, Robinho all making the type of runs he strives off of.

Sorry but you cannot blame Ibra for something he has no control over, also saying he flopped in Barca because he didn't provide any movement is just BS, he scored a lot of goals there while practically being made to sit out half of the season, for mere mortals that is a great season imo.

[acid911]

imo the only thing holding them back is a petty competition that is going on between the two of them.

It's not as petty as it seems. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) Ibra, as a senior player should have taken Pato under his wings as a young prodigy, just like Ronaldo did in his time couple of years at Milan. That would have been beneficial for both the players. But oh, Ibra the wise likes to be the biggest fish in the pond.

For all intents or purposes that was one of the reasons for our early CL exit.

[Jack Sparrow]

Tbh....I don't think we wanted the CL. I honestly don't think so. I didn't see it that evening when we played. That CL fire...which they put on. I think only Zee wanted it.

[acid911]

Agreed, but that in itself is a bad thing, don't you say? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) We should have at least qualified for the quarters, a matter of prestige and a few extra millions. Any given Sunday, with the amount of quality on display, we are at top 10 or top 8 club, and that is the minimum what should have been on display.

Of course, Serie A should remain the main ambition, but that does not mean we should take CL as lightly.