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Posted by: han2503 Dec 9 2013, 02:45 PM

Most important game of the season by far. Both from a financial aspect and a footballing one

All we need to get through is a draw, if we mess this up there is seriously no hope left for us

Posted by: Danny Dec 9 2013, 02:50 PM

Needing a draw is unfortunately the worst psychological mindset to go into a match with.

Posted by: acid911 Dec 9 2013, 02:52 PM

Quoted for truth. It's Ajax for crying out loud, they can give us a regret or two to remember anytime!

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 9 2013, 03:19 PM

Mediaset line-up: Abbiati; Abate, Mexes, Bonera, De Sciglio; Montolivo, De Jong, Muntari; Kakà, El Shaarawy, Balotelli.

Yay, Muntari is back!!!

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 9 2013, 03:24 PM

Urby suffered a knock today in training, his presence for the game is in doubt.

Source: Sky

Posted by: Jack Sparrow Dec 9 2013, 03:34 PM

This is a bad situation. Not the best prepared setup to go into the game, but let's hope we can pull it off.

Needless to say, if we lose Allegri must be fired.

Posted by: Danny Dec 9 2013, 03:34 PM

Interesting team tbh, if remotely accurate. Problem is these outlets, as you know, get it wrong 100% of the time so that won't be the team.

I won't even try to guess what the team will be.

Posted by: Danny Dec 9 2013, 03:38 PM

Problem is this is an Ajax team in the ascendancy. Second in the Eredivisie, last 6 matches have been excellent wins including beating Barcelona.

They're suddenly on a hot streak and won't be pushovers.

If we get the draw I'd be overjoyed.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 9 2013, 03:40 PM

I don't agree. A draw would be the minimum requirement. It doesn't matter if Ajax has been winning non-stop lately. We're playing at home, the most important game of the season, with all our best players at disposal. We should aim for the win, and we should get it.

Posted by: Rossoneri7 Dec 9 2013, 03:58 PM

A draw would see us qualify? Then Im all for it. What is important here is to qualify.

As for Allegri leaving ... Where have I heard that before

Posted by: Danny Dec 9 2013, 04:59 PM

I stand by my point. We need a draw, and that will play on the players' minds as being the requirement. It's a terrible mindset because what do you do if you're 1-1 with 3 minutes to go and Ajax are dominating?

It's a horrible result to need because your mindset is not focused on victory.

And before you say 'it should be', well, that's the problem. It isn't.

As for our best players, we may well have all our players back now (more or less) but you and I know Allegri will not start them all.

Posted by: kurtsimonw Dec 9 2013, 05:36 PM

Allegri's never leaving. We're actually all living inside X-Offs nightmare.

Posted by: drucurl Dec 9 2013, 05:40 PM

Imagine Kaka does an '07

Then max will become "champions league winning coach Allegri". Then an extension would obviously be in order

Won't know if to celebrate or jump off a bridge

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 9 2013, 06:35 PM

It's one freaking long nightmare, then.



It's the Champions League. I'd personally give Allegri the extension if we win it.

Posted by: Linkman Dec 10 2013, 03:36 AM

I can just see Muntari scoring a Hattrick in the final.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 10 2013, 01:36 PM

Abate didn't recover. It'll be DS on the right with either Constant or Emanuelson on the left.

Posted by: Danny Dec 10 2013, 04:27 PM

I was wrong about DS btw, he said himself today he's happier on the right and is right footed. He's accustomed to the left slot too but is happier and, to quote him, 'can do things on the right he can't manage on the left'.

I swore he was two footed.



And Urby almost certainly won't be available - he missed training I believe and is an 80% certainty to miss the match entirely.



Constant will start, Allegri attested to this today (see above).

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 10 2013, 04:30 PM

Great, f*cking Constant.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 10 2013, 06:31 PM

Silvio and MILF arrive at Milanello.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKNv0-hbNjc

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 10 2013, 07:21 PM

Big Boss with players.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeodeW55Nx4

Posted by: Linkman Dec 10 2013, 08:09 PM

Wait, she's a mom?

She is! who knew

Posted by: Danny Dec 10 2013, 10:15 PM

Well the pregnancy 'rumours' started while she was with Duck but went quiet. I never saw her 'large' I must say but apparently that sprog was indeed Pato's and was Babs' third after her failed marriage.

Classy bird.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 10 2013, 10:42 PM

No, she was never pregnant. Her two children are from her previous marriage.

Posted by: Danny Dec 10 2013, 11:10 PM

According the media in June this year she gave birth to her third kid.

Posted by: Rossoneri7 Dec 10 2013, 11:27 PM

Wow ... How old is she?

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 10 2013, 11:36 PM

********. She only has two kids. You think people wouldn't have known if she had given birth?

Posted by: Danny Dec 11 2013, 02:17 AM

What's with the angry asterisks?

And I appear to have made an error anyway. I misread a few search results - there were claims about pregnancy but you're right, it was hogwash.

Posted by: Danny Dec 11 2013, 02:18 AM

2 kids, 29. Nothing abnormal tbh. Wonder where she finds the time as a working (divorced) mother.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 02:29 AM

B0llocks.

Posted by: Rossoneri7 Dec 11 2013, 06:48 AM

Last time Ajax came to San Siro, they won by two goals.

Posted by: William405 Dec 11 2013, 09:00 AM

This time they'll lose by four.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 12:59 PM

We were already qualified.

Posted by: Rossoneri7 Dec 11 2013, 02:38 PM

And of course Allegri would have nothing to do with it, unless we loose then the fault is on him

Posted by: acid911 Dec 11 2013, 02:42 PM

Of course.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 02:58 PM

Bonera to play instead of Mexes according to Mediaset.

WHY???

Posted by: TriniKing_CE Dec 11 2013, 03:56 PM

Oh Dear God...

Posted by: Danny Dec 11 2013, 04:18 PM

If true I'm fine with this. Bonera has been not at all bad since he's been in, and Mexes I truly think has been quite poor this season.

But it's probably nonsense.

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 04:32 PM

Bonera? He was only half decent againt Celtic. Marking the walking mop that is Samaras, and even then he let him get the better of him a couple of times

All the other times he was on the verge of commiting a major mistake any time something came anywhere near him

Mexes has been easily the best CB for us this season, I can't remember him commiting any major mistakes, not to mention having to cover for Zapata multiple times over the season

If Allegri is truely choosing Bonera over Mexes while Mexes is apparently fit and available then he has truely lost his mind

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 05:03 PM

I think these "if Allegri etc etc" comments shouldn't be used since Allegri has proved a gazillion of times that he's an idiot.

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 05:42 PM

I remember Milan-Ajax the season we won the CL. I think it was the semi final. Score was 2-2 at the 90th minute and milan would be eliminated. Ajax making a sub to gain time , brochhi pushing Pienaar of the field cause he was slowly walking andgave that arrogant smile as he was going off the field knowing they were trough. But then came that cross in the final seconds and Inzaghi lobs the ball over the defence and scores the 3-2 . What an amazing night it was Ok officially Tomasson scored it ...

Posted by: acid911 Dec 11 2013, 05:53 PM

I recall it too.

Posted by: TriniKing_CE Dec 11 2013, 06:41 PM

I too recall that moment. Pure Bliss!!

I was really upset Tomasson touched it at the last moment to be honest though, as I didn't care much for him at all, and I wanted Pippo to rack up as much goals in Europe as possible.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 07:38 PM

Who can forget it. I actually cried that night. The only time I've cried for Milan because of joy.

PS: It was the quarter-finals, not semis.



The goal was assigned to Pippo, wasn't it?

Posted by: William405 Dec 11 2013, 08:31 PM

Wow, that sounds like it was so intense.


Bonera and Muntari in the official lineup. Good news is the trident of Kaka-Sharaawy-Balotelli is exciting.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 08:51 PM

F*ck. Lucky.

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 09:05 PM

Bonera is allready busting my chops !!!

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 09:08 PM

constant trying to keep the ball in by kicking it further out ...

Monto monto ! Idiot fucking Idiot !!!!!! at their half !!!!!

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:08 PM

What an idiot.

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 09:08 PM

Monto red....

Yes it was a terrible foul but it wasn't with any intent

Excessive imo

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 09:08 PM

Ladies and gentlemen our captain....gtfo

Posted by: TriniKing_CE Dec 11 2013, 09:08 PM

Red for Monto OMG!!!!!

Posted by: Milan Are Brilliant Dec 11 2013, 09:09 PM

Disgusting tackle, ankle breaker. I hate Poulsen but there's no choice there.

Idiot.

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 09:09 PM

what a joke , what an idiot why is he the captain!!

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:10 PM

It was fully deserved, han. Idiot of a captain.

Posted by: Milan Are Brilliant Dec 11 2013, 09:11 PM

There's absolutely no way you can defend that.

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 09:11 PM

The thing is, we probably see one of those ever week but rarely is it a red

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:12 PM

It doesn't matter. It was a terrible, terrible foul.

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 09:13 PM

So the stamp on Balo isn't a red... Nice

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:14 PM

Man, we can't attack for sh*t now. If we concede we're done for.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:16 PM

Bonera so far has been HORRIBLE. Good one, Allegri.

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 09:16 PM

Let's face it, we've been terrible with 11 on the pitch and just as terrible now with 10

We have to defend for our lives and just play for the draw now

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:19 PM

We're too static.

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 09:19 PM

Time to bring ronaldinho in , oh wait we sold that genius !

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 09:20 PM

Now Abbiati has a problem, do we have a keeper for the CL available?

Posted by: acid911 Dec 11 2013, 09:22 PM

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:24 PM

Coppola.

This is horrible. We can't do sh*t. Not even a decent combo.

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 09:25 PM

Was about to say the same thing , simple football skills seems to be too much asked...

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:26 PM

Muntari and Constant on that left are a huge liability, both defensively and offensively. Muntari especially is so sssssslow.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:30 PM

You would at least expect our players to be fierce and aggressive, but instead they look like a bunch of scaredy cats.

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 09:34 PM

and it would be a red every week.

just wish Kaka' or Abbiati was our perma captain i know Monti was captain of Fiorentina.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:34 PM

0-0 HT

Can't see us drawing this one. Eventually they'll score. Allegri's terrible choices and our dear captain's idiocy will do us.

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 09:36 PM

Mattia De Sciglio has been a ray of hope in this game , also made a Maldini esc tackle !

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 09:39 PM

.
Don't forget the mediocracy of our team. Besides Kaka and maybe Balo

Posted by: Danny Dec 11 2013, 09:40 PM

Can't fathom what Monto was thinking of. Truly awful 'tackle' and a clear red.

But in a way I thank him because we've been better in his absence - tighter, more controlled, and while we haven't created a lot of chances we've worked far harder. Ajax have barely threatened since we went to 10.

So far DS has been excellent, Muntari has used the ball well and been maybe our best midfielder, and Balo has been as us Scots call 'canny' up top.

Zapata has also been quite decent at the back so far.

Hard work to get the draw but psychology changes when you're down to 10.

Kaka has had his second quiet (by his standards) match in a row. Maybe he's having a little dip.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:41 PM

Had we had the right players on the pitch (Mexes and Poli for f*cking Bonera and Muntari) and had Montolivo not done something completely asinine things would have been different. El Shaa especially was looking very lively tonight.

We're our own demise.

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 09:46 PM

Had had had ... Even they are mediocre.

Get some f*cking class players and this game was allready won.

Bunch of overpayed unworthy milan shirt wearing bunch of b-squad players !!

But its not their fault , they were bought ...

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:48 PM

We have to do with what we have. And besides, Abate, Mexes, De Sciglio, Monto, De Jong, Poli, Kaká, El Shaa, Balo just to name a few, they're not b-squad players, not matter how you look at it. Plus we'll have Pazzini, Honda and Rami in January.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:54 PM

Oh FFS, why does Muntari take 424324 hours before deciding to pass.

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 09:56 PM

Muntari and Constant on that left side are just...

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:58 PM

Wow, Bonera has fucked up every single pass so far.

Posted by: nuh Dec 11 2013, 09:58 PM

we can't pass to save our lives

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 09:59 PM

We're playing the same erratic headless chicken football we played against Livorno

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 09:59 PM

What the hell is Allegri doing? Are we supposed to go through the rest of the game like this?

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 10:03 PM

When we're attacking it's 2-3 players against 6-7. The rest just don't follow. Brilliant.

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:04 PM

Really , what can he do with this b-squad ? How bad he may be , im afraid we must horror movie till the end...

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 10:04 PM

Tell his players to push!!!

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:05 PM

Our striker clearing the ball in our box ...

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:07 PM

Are you deaf ? He is been doing that all match . Its the players who arent pushing...

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:10 PM

What??

All he's been doing is yelling "NO NO" at the ref!

No this isn't a b-team, we're a man down, the players are just completely undisciplined as we saw throughout this entire season, going a man down is just continuing to show how tactically clueless our players are as they don't know what to do in this situation

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:11 PM

Great save Abbiati !

Posted by: Rossoneri7 Dec 11 2013, 10:11 PM

Careless! If we loose today, Monto shoulders the blame, not Allegri. Careless.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 10:11 PM

No mate, he hasn't. What are the hell you talking about? If a coach orders you to push forward, you do it. The players have been given clear instructions to protect the result, otherwise they wouldn't be parking the bus.

But if Allegri has indeed told them to push and they aren't doing it, then it simply tells you what an utterly useless coach he is, that his own players don't listen to him.

Posted by: nuh Dec 11 2013, 10:12 PM

This has to be by far the worst performance i've ever seen by milan.
A whole new low.

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:14 PM

This Milan is a B-team now , when we won the scudetto we werent.

I repeat , B-squad.

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:15 PM

Yes, it was careless from Monto, but we've been playing like sh!t from minute 1, as has been the case for 99% of our matches this season

Posted by: kurtsimonw Dec 11 2013, 10:16 PM

I remember when people thought Bojan should be starting for us.

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:16 PM

This team is not Milan quality , as far as Im concerend Allegri and half of the team can all leave.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 10:17 PM

And? Does that justify parking the bus? Livorno are a C-team, yet they didn't play on Saturday like we're playing tonight. Whether you're an A, B, C or Z team has nothing to do with the mentality you showcase on the pitch. But if your coach is a complete tool, then obviously he's gonna tell you to protect the result and play like a bunch of pussies.

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:19 PM

You can feel the goal coming from a mile away at this point

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:21 PM

I dont care about Allegri !! I want capable talented players like Kaka at Milan. End of story

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:22 PM

Milan is going trough , I feel it

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:24 PM

So now he brings on Mexes What a tool!

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:27 PM

I think this is your main problem here. We've come to accept that Milan is simply no longer going to be buying players of a certain calibre, the majority of us have simply made peace with that very fact.

So when you don't have top players in every position, you need a strong leader to coach the team, something we simply do not have

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:27 PM

Djeezes Constant ... A simple ball to control ...

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:31 PM

Then I'd rather blame the managment. They had the money for pazzini, matri and balo. Money was no problem then...

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:33 PM

Well they're as bad as Allegri, but to get Ibra calibre players you have to pay them Ibra calibre salaries, which we simply couldn't afford to do

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:34 PM

linesman helping us now

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:35 PM

4 more minutes to go

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:37 PM

Ibra was a bargain , ronaldinho was a bargain , sam as thiago silva.

Then scout the world for some decent talent as they once did.

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:38 PM

But their wages weren't that's the point, we can afford the initial transfer fee but we cannot keep these players in the long term

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:39 PM

Through!!

Posted by: CrazyMilanFan Dec 11 2013, 10:40 PM

YES.. much needed financially..

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:40 PM

Also great to point out, Muntari misses next match!

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 10:41 PM

Well we fought like lions tonight ! So close at the end i thought that was going in , Balo on the last header !

It was a dirty dirty game but we had to do it , going down to 10 and then having to defend for the rest of the game.

Posted by: TriniKing_CE Dec 11 2013, 10:41 PM

+1

Our MOTM Balo - No Questions!

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:41 PM

We qualified !! With 10 men and a b-squad I'm surprised we did

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 10:42 PM

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:42 PM

Yeah, he defender, tried to do whatever he could in attack and did his best to waste max amount of time at every opportunity he could

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 10:43 PM

You don't need to be Bayern to beat this Ajax at home.

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 10:43 PM

Thought you'd get the irony

what a joke this coach this!

Posted by: han2503 Dec 11 2013, 10:44 PM

More like we fought like little bitches and pulled hair and pinched from behind at every opportunity.

Humiliating display but we got the money for going through, so who the hell cares how we managed it

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 10:45 PM

well we're through with a **** *** team so i dont give a **** really.

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:45 PM

You mean Berlusconi cant pay them ? One of the richest persons in Italy ? Yeah right ...

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 10:46 PM

I wish someone would get a compilation of Allegri raging down the touch line its hilarious.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 10:47 PM

It's not Berlusconi who pays them, it's the club. If the club has no money from self-financing, then you can't pay high wages.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 10:48 PM

He was screaming to himself. No-one cares what this coach says. Oh, if only we had someone like Mourinho...

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 10:48 PM

You don't say...

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 10:49 PM

rofl i don't want someone that has won the trebble for inter to coach Milan regardless if hes the special one he can stay at Chelsea and fail to win the CL there.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 10:49 PM

Well, Nova clearly doesn't get it.

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 10:50 PM

Then please tell me how Monaco and Psg all off a sudden can pay t.he transfers and the wages

Posted by: Zed.D Dec 11 2013, 10:52 PM

Milan is disgraced. lowest of lows.

Posted by: Danny Dec 11 2013, 10:55 PM

Superb second half display from a Milan team who deserved to go through.

That's the hardest I've seen us work, up against it and we were just too damn smart for Ajax.

Balo was a hero - yeah, bit naughty now and again but some of his work was superb. Defended superbly in the second half, and while Ajax had a lot of shots they rarely really threatened at all.

Muntari had, imo, his finest match as a Milan player - really excellent use of the ball and some superb passes.

Kaka bit quiet, not his best, and I wasn't surprised he was subbed.

It boiled down to us being too clever in the end for a naive Ajax and I am extremely proud of the team; up against it needing only a point.

Bring on the draw and our mutilation at the hands of whatever group topper we get.

I do look forward to January when I pray we bring in more than just Rami and Honda. Because we need more.

PS: El-Sha showed SORT of signs of quality but still looks off the pace. Easy sacrifice to make.

Posted by: Danny Dec 11 2013, 10:57 PM

And yet they beat Barca who tonight beat Celtic like 100-1?

I know Ajax aren't the Ajax of old here but we had 10 men and that makes a MUCH bigger difference in CL than it does in Serie A?

Posted by: Linkman Dec 11 2013, 10:58 PM

11th time through in a row, suck it Inter and Juve!

(feel slightly sad for Napoli, they were unlucky)

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 11:01 PM

Does everyone think we were going to beat this Ajax team with 11 men on the pitch because we looked **** with 11 to start with. We were very fortunate to get a draw at all just check the stats i dread to think how many clear cut chances they had. If they stopped crossing it in so much they would have scored more then one.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 11:04 PM

Do you know that we are owned by Fininvest, who only recently had to cover a staggering €520 million hole because of the Mondadori legal fiasco? Do you also know that the club is trying to be self-sufficient in order to comply with the Financial Fair Play regulations? How PSG and Monaco do it? http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1753485-how-paris-saint-germain-and-monaco-will-beat-financial-fairplay.

Posted by: William405 Dec 11 2013, 11:05 PM

Okay, I don't see how this was the lowest of lows for us. Or, did anyone forget our previous confrontation with Ajax where we just allowed them to attack? It was probably the safest decision, and the correct one in my opinion. Sure, I would have preferred us going on the break, and counterattacking Ajax..but do we really have the right players for that?

Balo sometimes went down too easily, and it isn't newsflash that Muntari isn't the cleanest player ever.
It's a bit disappointing because we started out pretty well with Sharaawy showing signs of improvement. He was out for a long time, and I'll take that as a good sign. Although, it may seem the last thing on our mind at the moment.

There is nothing much to say about the game except that perhaps against a more experienced team we would have been destroyed. We've truly been lucky with our opposition teams. De Sciglio was class. Abbiati saved in more than one occasion. Balo sacrificed himself for the team today, props to him.

Posted by: William405 Dec 11 2013, 11:06 PM

Agreed on all points.

Posted by: William405 Dec 11 2013, 11:07 PM

Our possible opponents: Man U, Real, PSG, Bayern, Chelsea, Dortmund, or Atletico

I don't see us qualifying against any of those teams to be honest.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 11 2013, 11:07 PM

I'm with you, Zed. Can't see how these people think we deserved to go through simply because we defended well. It was a shameful performance, simple as.

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 11 2013, 11:12 PM

I don't get what you expected us to do going down to 10 men.

Can you explain in the tactics you would have employed going down to 10 men. I think the rest of us on here would like to know. Yes we played very very dirty that was shameful not arguing with you there Balo could of easily been sent off multiple times and so could of a few others.

But again i want to know what you would have done taken Allegri's place.

Maybe sleep on it and tell us tomorrow ?

Posted by: Jack Bauer Dec 11 2013, 11:15 PM

Monto should be fined for that red card. Especially as a captain, you can't let the team down like that.

Posted by: Linkman Dec 11 2013, 11:16 PM

I think we can take...

Real. And only because we're lucky against them. Any of the other 6 and we're doomed

Posted by: Nova Dec 11 2013, 11:18 PM

If that is true then Milan should throw in the towel now. Dont act like a top team when you have the finances of Udinese.

Then , when did we ever buy 11 super stars ?? We had maybe 3 top players bought and others came trough superdeals or
wonderfull scouting. Both of wich doesnt cost fortunes.

Posted by: nuh Dec 11 2013, 11:28 PM

I'd take United

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 12 2013, 12:08 AM

Being one man down doesn't justify parking the bus and doing absolutely nothing but defend for the whole game. This was Ajax, not Barcelona. They were vulnerable. They had zero creativity. We laid down a red carpet for them and even though they pushed and pushed they just couldn't sting. Sure, our defenders did well, but had it been any other team we wouldn't be praising our boys' "glorious performance".

What would have I done? First of all, I would have played the right men. Secondly, and this is something even an amateur knows, I would have advised my players to press and keep the defence a tad (just a tad) high. That way we wouldn't have been crushed, and we wouldn't have given to Ajax the hope and motivation to keep pushing forward. What if one of their crosses or high balls had gone in? We'd be talking about a completely different game.



Agreed. It was just plain asinine.



That I can agree with. We've done some terrible deals lately, and it all falls down on Galliani. €12 million for Matri? GTFO!



United, Chelsea or Atletico. The rest will crush us without mercy.

Posted by: Danny Dec 12 2013, 01:14 AM

I'll bite here; how do you hold a higher line with one less player? The point of holding a higher line is if you DO get penetrated in midfield you've got enough players to cover those doing the pressing. We didn't here. We had one less player, so instead of having 2 attackers behind the ball with Balo ahead, we only had one.

How do you cover for others' being out of position when you don't actually have a player with which to do it?

Furthermore how do you dominate with one less man when you're not naturally a dominant, passing team? This Milan team isn't Barca, we know that. We use the wings/fullbacks and go through the middle now and again via Kaka.

I remain absolutely over the moon with the guile, industry, and work rate we put in. I warned beforehand that a draw is the worst result to need, and I stand by that. Look at Juve yesterday, they fell at this hurdle with a stupid, daring performance and got mugged by a clever Gala. We were smart and didn't do what we couldn't, especially down to 10 men.

Classic Milan tonight - exactly the same as we've done V Barca, but with one less man in our team this time.

Allegri got it right overall, because we're in the last 16.

(we were bound to violently disagree on football sooner rather than later )

Posted by: Danny Dec 12 2013, 01:14 AM

Utd are the only side we have even a shred of a chance against. The rest, including Chelsea and Atletico, will destroy us.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 12 2013, 01:33 AM

I said just a tad so we wouldn't get crushed. How? By pressing like a bunch of rabid dogs. It doesn't matter that we were with one man down. We could and should have shown a much more aggressive character, fighting for every ball everywhere on the pitch, not just in the last 16. Instead, we acted like a bunch of pussies as if we were playing Barça or Madrid or Bayern in ten men.

You say we played it clever? I say we played it shamefully. If I were a Juve fan, judging today's match alone, I would have felt proud of my team. They played in impossible conditions, away against a team that had to win, but even so they never got suppressed or felt fearful, but kept running and running for all 90 minutes, exerting intense pressure on their opponent and overall played better. They just got unlucky in the end. Galatasaray were barely dangerous except a few occasions. I know cos I saw the whole game.

I repeat, what if one of Ajax's crosses or high balls had gone in? Like the very last one, which was so close to the bar. What would you be saying about this glorious, historic, ingenious performance of ours? Would you be praising the team regardless? I wonder.

We were just lucky, that's all. Lucky and embarrassing.



They'll all beat us, those three are just inferior to the rest.

Posted by: Danny Dec 12 2013, 01:42 AM

First off running after the ball like dogs for 70 minutes with 10 men just isn't possible. They're men, not machines. They showed the right attitude imo.



That's what I said - they were clever and outsmarted Juve.

I'd rather be through to the last 16 on a clever display than out of the tournament having given it my all. Show me a good loser and I'll show you a loser.



I don't think in 'what ifs'. Stopped doing that in 1999.



It's funny X - everything you're saying here, it's justifying what I said pre-match. A draw is the worst result to need. Do you understand why now?



Curiously the commentators, while clearly disappointed that Ajax were so naive, were praising of our display and said it was superb in light of 10 men. No one thinks we were embarrassing tonight apart from a few of our fans I guess.



I don't agree. I think Atletico and Chelsea are as strong as the other 5. It's just Utd who are weaker. But we do agree on this one small caveat - we'll lose in the next round.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 12 2013, 01:53 AM

They could have altered their work rate, but the idea is to keep pressing your opponent.



Outsmarted Juve? FFS man, they got lucky! They didn't outsmart sh*t. You're twisting their win to your liking.




Then you're just not seeing the whole picture.



I didn't disagree with that. I disagreed about you saying you'd be overjoyed with a draw. IMO we should have won this, or at least with 10 men we should have shown determination instead of fear.



That's not a good thing. If the commentators think we played a superb game, it just shows how far we have fallen, where a tight draw against Ajax is considered a brilliant performance.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 12 2013, 02:16 AM

Just saw the extended highlights of Napoli-Arsenal. These guys know how to approach a crucial game. Against Arsenal, nonetheless.

Posted by: TriniKing_CE Dec 12 2013, 04:02 AM

Napoli's exit is definitely hard to watch.

It doesn't do well for Italy's European UEFA coefficient either.



In this case, the stats pretty much speak for themselves:
http://www.whoscored.com/Matches/776586/Live



Correct.
On current form alone being considered, ManU will be our best bet, but I'm pretty certain that they will improve by next year. Even if not, they and all may be a bit too much for us to chew at the moment (which says a whole lot).

Posted by: Fillipo Simone Dec 12 2013, 08:21 AM

...it would literary be the end. Surely he would do well, but no, he's not a good fit for the Milan I would like to happen.


I think you're both exaggerating too much. Shameful? Maybe, but I wouldn't go that far. The context is shameful, Milan reduced to the team and mentality displayed over and over again. But this particular match was a normal Italian defensive display, I've seen this kind of defending since Sacchi and Capello, it's nothing to be ashamed of. We blocked them, we blocked them well. Only aerial balls were problems (and set pieces, which Allegri fails to understand).

Posted by: Fillipo Simone Dec 12 2013, 10:07 AM

New poll http://www.milanfan.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=8302&st=0

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 12 2013, 12:11 PM

and people wanted us to attack with those stats....we would have conceded without a doubt and not of scored.

Posted by: Danny Dec 12 2013, 12:12 PM

I disagree with much of your post, no point arguing till we're blue in the face, but the fact you're debating that I'm not seeing the full picture because I don't yearn for what 'might have been' does suggest mild irony because I'd argue you've basically ignored the fact we were down to 10 men and keep harping on about the performance not being up there with Sacchi's Milan.

Like Pippo said it was a typical Italian Catenaccio display. tbh, it was no different to the one V Barca that we won 2-0. Difference is we lost a man.

I think your anger is purely because you don't rate Ajax. Which I find curious given, as I said, they are on 6 straight wins including 2 in the CL. They're not Cruyff's men any more but they're no pushovers. Ask Barcelona.

I think you have a lack of respect for the opponents last night tbh.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 12 2013, 02:00 PM

I remember Ancelotti's Milan being reduced to ten men against Brugge and Anderlecht, yet we didn't defend like a bunch of scaredy cats. And before everyone mentions the quality of both sides (that Milan and this Milan), let me just say that I never said we should have played better last night. This is what everyone fails to understand. It's the mentality, the attitude and approach that really irk me. Yes, we were one man down, but is that an excuse to park the bus and do NOTHING but defend for all the game?



Oh yes, I don't rate this Ajax. We were one man down last night, we laid a red carpet for them to do whatever they pleased, and all they could do were a bunch of crosses and high balls. How's that a good team? They beat Barça at home when they were already qualified and without Messi? Big deal! They had a five games winning streak in the Eredivise? Wow, amazing! They're not even first for that matter. They're just an average team, typical Ajax of the last few seasons. We had everything to beat them last night. Obviously Montolivo's idiocy changed our tactics, but we should have never raised barricades as if Barça, Bayern and Madrid combined were assaulting us. It was humiliating.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 12 2013, 02:46 PM

Coaches in Champions League

Posted by: Fillipo Simone Dec 12 2013, 08:29 PM

No. But saying this is a "disgrace" or "embarrassment" is an overstatement anyway.

I get what you're saying: the general mentality of the team is irritating and not even near to where Milan's should be.

Posted by: Rossoneri7 Dec 12 2013, 10:40 PM

Where should Milan be then? We can not afford the Champion players and we can not compete with the BIG spenders like Madrid and Barca. We do not have the allure to attract the lucrative sponsorships. We do not have the influence as do PSG with QIA and City with Etihad, to provide a blanket funding.

Sadly Pippo, this is exactly where Milan should be. This is the reality of it all, unless we drop FFP compliance and go back to Silvio funding our operating deficit of 60MM+.

Or for those that think finances are bullocks, fire Galliani and Allegri and get Maldini and Mourinho

Flavors of the day ... Now imagine what type of comments we would have had, had we been knocked out from progressing in the CL

Posted by: Danny Dec 12 2013, 10:59 PM

To be very controversial I should point out until Berlu bought us we'd only won the EC twice. It wasn't till the Silvio revolution that we actually became this marquee European club others feared.

So are we now where Milan should be?

Posted by: Nova Dec 12 2013, 11:01 PM

True , true and true.

But to be honest , were we ever a big spending club ? Compared to other teams I think not.

I dont recognize Milan anymore like the Milan I used to watch. I dont remember Milan splashed cash for Pirlo , Gattuso, Serginho, Kaka, Seedorf , etc ... And still managed to build a World team.

The current tranfer system really anoyes the hell out of me. If this is the best we can do , Im afraid dark ages are ahead of us.

Posted by: Fillipo Simone Dec 12 2013, 11:05 PM

Yes and no.

Firstly, I never mentioned finances. Financial problems don't exactly have to be translated into mentality problems. Milan of today is infected with Allegri's small-club mentality. At first it was a easy phrase thrown into an argument as soon as Allegri made a few mistakes. But nowadays it's almost a fact. We have an under-performing captain who's not big enough to step up or at least fit in the shoes of his predecessors, we're filled with "destructors" and "workers", we have young spoiled kids who think they're kings of the world when they score 10+ goals...shall I keep this listing?

But the main problem is our coach handles Milan like it was Cagliari. You see, he'd win Italian coach of the year award for his European achievement, just if you'd remove 'AC Milan' and put in 'AS Cagliari'. He does not know how to think bigger, make bolder decisions, create order in a much more complex surrounding with fans used to small wins and expecting the impossible on regular basis.

Now to the financial part. Yes, we're in trouble. But the thing is, we made a couple of big mistakes that don't relate to Finivest or Berlusconi's financial troubles. First and most important, we've been neglected by Silvio for years. He's outgrown Milan and replaced his favorite toy with politics. Secondly, Italy is a mess, a mess that's (in a legislative way) hitting Serie A as well - and Berlusconi has a big part in this mess in general. Thirdly, we've lost a certain hunger and became addicted to keeping a "status quo" or slowing down our decay. In a way, Berlusconi lead us to the situation (not exactly, as you surely know, but just in a way) Milan was prior to Silvio picking us up.

This "status quo" thing is what bugs me mostly with Galliani. I'm not intending to repeat Han's thesis on wage-wasting and keeping the veterans. The only thing I'm gonna say is: regeneration is key for consistently keeping up with the top clubs. And when you have a chance of mixing youth with experience and class - like Paolo, Billy, Sandro or Pippo - you should grab it. Galliani decided not to do that, he tried to petrify our team, bringing as little as possible (insignificant) change. This strategy got us set for a breaking point in the near future.

The breaking point came with Allegri. All of a sudden, Milan changed course drastically, as if someone explained to our management that we can't keep counting on the same roster over and over again. Then old stars said goodbye, some of them with bitterness and spite, some of them graciously. All we had - not only in financial terms or in terms of class - but also in mentality, spirit, philosophy and strategy disappears. All of a sudden we were no more the happy family who's giving their players the royal treatment. All of a sudden things started to happen which in no way corresponded with what we knew as the "Milan way".

Galliani tried to sell a new strategy. But he did the same mistake. He proved to be a doctrinaire and rigidly tried to implement the new policy. What happened? Another bump, a big one, for our mentality. And the failure of this new plan (or better, the rigidity which lead to this premature failure), personified by Allegri, meant he had to go.

In the end, Galliani got completely carried away. You say we're in financial trouble; yet we keep doing so many unwise deals, not only the big one - like Oliveira or Matri. But the small ones, all the Mesbahs, Traores and Niangs.

Posted by: Fillipo Simone Dec 12 2013, 11:10 PM

It's not controversial at all. You're right. But this is what happens throughout history and what makes it immensely complex and interesting: you have the old clashing with the new. The new winning against the old, but just to become old and face the next level of new in another already lost battle.

To simplify, Berlusconi made Milan fresh, shined up the place, brought hunger and passion. He modernized things and pushed us to the top with a different approach. Now we're in a similar position to the one we had been prior Silvio's takeover. It's hardly irony, and mostly what history does.

Posted by: Rossoneri7 Dec 12 2013, 11:56 PM

Absolutely correct, until Silvio came in, we were doomed to be bankrupt.

We are exactly where we were back in 86, except now we have this reputation. Not that big when peered against Barcelona, but global appeal is there.

Milan should be in our hearts, that is where



You are right my man, our biggest transfer was somewhere around 30MM when we signed Costa. I was referring to operating expenses in wages. Today, the club set a wage-cap at 4MM. Compare that to what teams in the EPL, Bundesliga, Madrid, Barca, PSG, and Monaco pay and you'd see why players of a certain grade are rare in Milan these days. But that also is the case with Serie A as a whole, keep a close eye on inter (even with their new owner).

Over and above, since 2009/2010 the club has shifted funding to its youth sector more aggressively, and if I was to make an educated guess based on the solutions the club has on hand at the moment, it is to graduate the youth into the first team. A process that surely is very new to the Berlusconi era Milan.



Pippo, you know I love you So why do you make me read all that

joking, its always a pleasure


But finances are a big part of it all, they present a logical explanation as to why Milan is shite to watch these days. I don't want to bore you, so I'll save you from it all

I believe the turning point you are referring to started when Shevchenko was sold for 30MM. AC Milan, one of the pillars of European football selling its golden boy for a, as han would put it, meager 30MM. From that point onwards, a new phenomenon happened. One which lead to crazy figures being talked about in the market, last being 100MM for Bale. And should I even mention the wages?

Milan cant dream of spending that kind of money, even with Silvio's backing, simply because we do not generate the Revenue that Madrid do. Finances go hand in hand with all the above, but I do agree with you, in that our position on the table today is not a mirror image of our potential.

Sure we are a bigger club than Fiorentina or Genoa, and we lack a lot in the moral department. Allegri? I doubt anyone really cheers for him in this forum, but for the good of Milan I wish he takes us as close as possible to the top spot. Galliani? We humans are not God, we are not perfect, and for all we know Pippo, Galliani could have Milan's best interest at heart. Yet just like life nothing lasts and not everything is as it seems or how we would like (or not like) to assume.

The squad is not top quality overall, yet surely not 9th place! We can dream, but not as big a dream as you would have with Pippo upfront and Seedorf in midfield. Its all about managing expectations, and it is clear to me WE fans expect a LOT from Milan. That is where the disappointment comes in.

And you know what my biggest disappointment is? I don't even recognize these players, not even Balotelli, let alone our captain. From Paolo Maldini, Franco Baresi to Montolivo! From Andry Shevchenko and SuperPippo to Balotelli! Not being nostalgic, just that the new players don't transmit the same energy nor have the charisma as the predecessors.

Then you look at the bright side of it all, all the glory hunters will move on and these young/immature players man up and Milan go back to winning FFP-compliantly

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 13 2013, 01:21 AM

+∞



You mean £30 million, right?

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 13 2013, 01:30 AM

I love you man , you don't post very often anymore but when you do its gold. I also miss Tennie

Posted by: Ry4n Dec 13 2013, 01:43 AM

Great posts guys!

Thought on the last part about nostalgia . The one player that i think can be a beacon for this milan on where the old and new can look to for charisma and energy to which he has been a beam of hope is Mattia De Sciglio , its a joy to watch him play with such fluidity and hes still so young!

Posted by: han2503 Dec 13 2013, 09:40 AM

But we weren't losing that kind of money before when we had a team packed with stars, in fact I think we were making profits, and I'm getting this from that chart you often post.

Sheva was not sold for money, but after we sold him the competitiveness of the team dropped off a lot, the stars we had were getting older with only Kaka being the shining light within a rapidly fading bunch. A fading bunch we were still paying the kind of money you'd pay to players in their prime. Things spiralled from there, we weren't winning anymore, we weren't going into the latter stages of the CL with the amazing regularity we were doing so under Carlo during his best years, the fans weren't coming into the stadium with the regularity and amounts they were before and suddenly we found ourselves buried in a deep hole with no way out aside from selling our best players.

Yes the economic climate and the fact that we play in Italy does not help, but Galliani had a major hand in the mismanagement of the club. We've been going downhill financially from the moment Silvio handed over all the reigns to Galliani

Posted by: acid911 Dec 13 2013, 01:28 PM

Reins.

Posted by: han2503 Dec 13 2013, 04:40 PM

Whatever

Posted by: acid911 Dec 13 2013, 04:56 PM

Well I suppose we can happy you did not write 'regions'.

Posted by: Danny Dec 13 2013, 04:57 PM

True, but in defence of Han his typo is a Freudian slip.

For once Silvio reigned as boss of this great club, where now it's Galliani who reigns. Along with Babs.

Posted by: han2503 Dec 13 2013, 05:03 PM

Thanks Danny.

acid just likes to be a little **** to me about spelling.

Posted by: Fillipo Simone Dec 14 2013, 08:32 AM

The thing is, I do not trust Milan or anyone in the management to make this happen. Maybe the plan is set into motion, but the performance and final impact of this plan is more then questionable to me. Over the years our scouts managed to shock me more often then they surprised me in a positive way: Kaka is one, while various Grimi's and Niang's come to mind more quickly. Not to mention the monstrosity of the idea of Traore. I know, this plan is a long-term plan, and I know you're approaching to it bona fide. But various factors set warning signs.

Just remember Capello - saying he's not interested when it comes to a backroom position at Milan, because we have no project.


It's mutual.


Agreed, but it is not just the Italian context and the economic development that brought us into this position, it is Galliani's doing as well. He has Milan's best interest at heart, I'm sure, but his ways are not compatible to what we need right now. I think he's a great management asset in times of financial prosperity, but in these different times, he's just not useful anymore.

Reading your comments, one has to ask: what do you suggest then? How to avoid this financial slump we're in? Would you welcome a PSG-like takeover or do you tend to stay loyal with Berlu and the Italian model right till the end?


Agreed, but this disappointment is what makes me angry at Galliani. Don't you think we could have put more emphasis on youth and player development? So that we could breed the new batch of talents along our stars? Slowly introduce them along veterans and let them suck in their way, their approach and confidence.

What we did is reduce their legendary status. Why is van Basten considered a ultimate legend? Part of the truth is because he never managed to get old, so people always think of the best possible version of Marco. Look at what Gattuso did. When I say Rino, part of me wants to keep the early days in mind, when he was introduced as Milan's answer to Davids, a beast in midfield with passion and heart. But then pictures of a faded, slow and shabby Rino come, pictures of him holding Jordan by his neck and making scenes.

In a way, this provoked the youth to take a different path. You have Gattuso criticize young players like El Shaarawy, focused more on hairlines then fitness and goals, but then his own reputation does not help.

Surely, I'm not going to say any of them overstayed. Because this was part of the Milan vision, part of our plan. Boban said something similar few years ago. But what I'm angry for is that Galliani rigidly implemented this vision of Milan, even when the costs started becoming higher and higher, only to suddenly change course and throw all out the window for a cheap new replacement.


Agreed. And don't forget that Maldini has offspring



+1

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 14 2013, 01:56 PM

Totally agreed Fillipo, especially about the last part.

In the words of Paolo Maldini: "Milan has been transformed, from a magical team to an absolutely normal team. Because, unlike other great clubs with a similar glorious history, like Madrid, Barça and Bayern, where whoever wrote the history of the club now works there in order to transmit to the youngsters the values of what they leaned, at Milan the management has stopped transmitting this message, regardless of the club's investments. Inside the actual Milan there are no people from who those who made history for the club that have an important role".

Posted by: Danny Dec 16 2013, 12:02 AM

Well let's think about this. Galliani has been here since Silvio has - coinciding with our glory period. Silvio is still here and hasn't just sold out to Russian oil magnates under whom our future could be potentially unpredictable. Pippo is Primavera coach so remains integral.

Paolo is right that we are ordinary right now, but I'm not sure I buy his reasoning. Clubs do go through horrible slumps at times, and it doesn't always occur through mismanagement or a lack of youth philosophy.

Two examples in England; Liverpool - glorious history but in the past 27 years they've been out of the game. Man Utd - glorious history but this season mirroring us.

And furthermore we seem have a deluded memory of the Carlo days - he won 2 CL's yes, but the same f*cking number of Scudettos as Allegri with a vastly better squad.

When WERE these glory days Paolo alludes to? Late 80s? Yes. 90s? For sure. All bankrolled by Silvio.

It wasn't a lack of youth policy or club philosophy which has led to this right now - it's money. Nothing more.

Lastly, how many of Bayern's top players are from their own youth ranks?

3; Schweinsteiger, Lahm and Muller. That's it! They bought the rest of their team!

Money, sadly, drives football. It is what sets the top clubs apart. Just like us once upon a time.

Posted by: X-Offender Dec 16 2013, 12:41 AM

But the fact that Silvio and Galliani are still here means nothing. Our objectives in the past used to be scudetto and Champions League, now it's 3rd place and Round of 16. That's what the management asks, because they need the money. Winning is not an ambition anymore. And this philosophy is transmitted to the players. Especially when you have a coach with a small-club mentality like Allegri. I agree that money plays a very large role in this aspect, but I can see where Paolo is coming from.

Posted by: MizNelson Dec 16 2013, 07:50 AM

This so freaking much.

Again, not to get all nostalgic, but my Milan is from the mid-to-late 2000s. I still remember what I was doing when we won the '07 CL. In contrast, the guys today seem almost like...strangers.